Posted by: Helen Philpot | May 11, 2012

Mitt Happens

  HELEN:

Margaret, I just called my friend Patricia to apologize for dipping her hair into that inkwell back in grade school.  I feel bad that I did it and I feel even worse that she no longer remembers who I am or that she one time had hair long enough to put in pig tails.  We’re getting old, Margaret.  And you know what else is getting old?  The parade of schmucks who keep running for political office.

The population of the United States is now over 300 million people.   That means that every four years, one person out of 300 million gets the honor of being President of the greatest country on the planet.  With those odds, you would think the Republican Party could have found someone who wasn’t a dry drunk like George W. Bush… or the bully in high school like Mitt Romney.   I know.  I know.  We all did dumb things when we were young.  Youth.  I miss it like I miss my waistline.  Shit happens… or in this case Mitt happened.  “Back in high school, I did some dumb things,” Romney said. “And if anyone was hurt by that or offended, obviously I apologize for that.”   Me too.  I really do feel bad about dipping Patricia’s hair into that ink well.

Mitt went on to say, “There’s going to be some that want to talk about high school. Well, if you really think that’s important, be my guest.”

Thank you Mr. Romney, I think I will.  I think I will talk about this because unfortunately we don’t seem to have solved the problem yet.  Bullying is alive and well today and it is just as inexcusable today as it was 48 years ago.  You can send your wife out to the media to laugh about your “wild and crazy” high school years but I wonder how the two of you would have reacted if one of your sons had done that that had been done to one of your sons.  Wild and crazy?  Yes, actually.  It was.  And it’s even more wild and crazy today that anyone would want to honor you with the highest office in the land. Mitt was the son of a Governor… born into a privileged life.   You can’t tell me he didn’t know any better.

Mitt and a group of his friends threw a younger boy to the ground and hacked off his hair while he cried and screamed for help. The younger student was believed to be a little light in his loafers by the way, but Mitt now claims that he didn’t know he was gay.  As if that really matters.

Mitt led the charge and did the actual hair cutting.  Maybe I am overreacting here, but I think he just might not deserve to be that one person out of 300 million to be President. Believe it or not, lots and lots of people go through their entire school career and never dip another person’s hair in ink or physically abuse another student.

I have said before, I come from a generation that doesn’t really talk much about gay people.  I remember thinking that a perfectly lovely word had been ruined.  Today, however I say, “Gay marriage?”  Why not?  Everyone should be allowed to be with the one they love.  I honestly don’t understand what all the hoopla is about.  If you don’t agree with gay marriage then don’t marry a man who dresses like Rick Santorum or has hair like Mitt Romney.  If you don’t like gay people simply ignore them.  They probably don’t like you either.  If an octogenarian from Georgia can see that, why can’t privileged politicians?

Margaret,  I really don’t think this is about being gay or the sanctity of marriage.  I think this is about common decency and what we should expect from that one person in 300 million who becomes President.  I’ll be the first to admit that I would not make a good president.  If ever an example of who not to elect there was, I certainly fit the bill.  But let’s slow down for just a second here.  He gathered a group of students.  They tackled a younger student and while that student cried and screamed for help, Mitt Romney, the assumed Republican nominee for President, cut off his hair because he didn’t like the way he looked. Does it matter if that student was gay? Would it be worse if he was black? How about if that student were a woman?  I don’t give a rat’s ass if that student were all three.  One in three hundred million.  One.

Maybe I am old school, as they say, but I really don’t think that one is forgettable much less forgivable when you want to become President.

No one is perfect.  But surely we can elect someone more perfect than that.  I mean it really.

  MARGARET:

Helen, dear, I think this all has to do with the length of time little Mitt was allowed to breast feed.  Or maybe he’s just a asshat.  Probably the latter, dear.

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Responses

  1. Commonly I wouldn’t understand write-up on blogs and forums, nonetheless would like to express that that write-up quite forced me to try and do the item! Ones writing style continues to be stunned us. Thanks, extremely great content.

  2. [...] for Mitt’s record – he was a bully in high school and got pretty upset when his father wasn’t elected President. At the age of 46 he was [...]

  3. It is not your fault or your greatness. This is NOT ABOUT YOU. It is about his right to make his own decisions, and to respond to adverse conditions that make it unpleasant to live in the US. Get used to it; a lot are following suit. The socialists have never learned, and never will, that you can’t force people to act against their own best interest. You can of course keep them from moving, but then they quit working and you still lose.

    They way to get the benefit from productive people is to make an environment where they want to be. Ref: pre-socialist America.

  4. alaskapi
    Yes it is called a mistake, we human women sometimes do that. By your reaction this is apparently as major issue so to the host I apologize for clicking the wrong link. Maybe a few deep breaths and some time away from the blog will get you some perspective alaskapi, didn’t think it was THAT big of a deal.

  5. For crying out loud Melinda- what are you doing on this old thread?
    you want to tell people something or tell em off or whatever, come on over to the current thread. Our hostesses are quite nice about letting us shoot off our virtual mouths, whatever our views are, but getting lost or dropping stink bombs in old threads might strain the situation some.

  6. “You may think it is a shame that people get all testy and cantankerous when you make statements that suggest you want to take away their rights, but that is just how it is. This isn’t about your belief that zygotes are children, it is about your obvious intent to impose that belief on others who do not share it.”

    You like want to impose a death sentence upon the unborn child? My way inconveniences you for 9 months. You way takes away everything that child will ever have, forever. Again the problem is you cannot allow any compromise, any discussion. To bring up the subject offense. You create an argument where to find common ground infringes upon your rights. I find it hypocritical that you are so concerned about your rights, that you give the unborn child’s rights no consideration at all.

    I am not hurt or offended. I am simply pointing out that you are incapable of reasoned discussion. I am pointing out that you are bigoted against anyone who doesn’t think as you do. You do not allow for it, while I welcome it. That is our defining difference.

    Iris, you are mischaracterizing what I said. I cannot have common ground with people who cannot have a discussion on the issue. As I stated above, the fact most of you feel your rights are infringed upon just by it being brought up. Also the fact that you decide that the unborn child has no rights, and you have no room to allow for discussion on this as well. The only possible outcome you will except is that the child gets no consideration whatsoever. This is why we have no common ground.

    As for being called a murderer, sorry if the definition fits. You take a life, and you end it. We have had children born in the 5th month survive. Yet you all insist on the right to take children even in the 8th and 9th month and end their life. This is the very definition of murder. You may not like this, but facts are facts.

  7. I am not very excellent with English but I get hold this rattling easygoing to understand .

  8. Thank you Farsight. I do care, which is why I posted my statement that I have never been anyone but Backgammon on this, or any other site.
    We obviously have different views,which is what makes for debate, and not being a sheep. Trust you had a wonderful Memorial weekend.

  9. Backgammon, sorry if I have misjudged you. If you were to take the time to go back over the last year+ (don’t really expect you to), you would understand my distrust of the timing of your arrival. Anon/Noah/nagic has reincarnated himself so many times that there is a reason posters herein refer to him as the Hydra. One of his MOs is to have 2-3 identities going at the same time in order to bolster an argument. At the same time in recent history, he has bragged about this behavior on Rutherford’s site.

    As I said, I am sorry IF I misjudged you. However, just because you say you are not the hydra in no way makes me gullible enough to unquestioningly accept the proclamation. As before, time will tell. If you are not the hydra, I would be surprised if you even gave a rat’s ass about all this. Nor would I expect if of you…

  10. I am sending a check to Diane Tran: She is an amazing girl who deserves support – not jail and a criminal record. I hope the judge resigns.

    Got this info from Juanita Jean comment section.
    Ms. Diane Tran
    c/o The Vineyards of Waverly Manor
    1961FM 1375 Rd.E
    Huntsville TX 77340

    Sent a check and perhaps you will too.

    http://juanitajean.com/2012/05/27/do-like-mitt-said-if-you-dont-have-20000-to-start-your-business-borrow-it-from-your-dad/comment-page-1/#comment-26034

  11. Was certain the Diane Tren case would end up here! Thank goodness. This is a case of child abuse/abandonment inasmuch as she and her two younger siblings are under 18. She has a totally heroic perspective of “family”. By supporting the younger ones, she was hoping to keep them out of the foster system. What happened to them when she was in the slammer for a night? The judge in this case had the option of referring the whole thing to family court and issuing warrents against the absent parents. Instead he victimizes the victim all over again. Oh, well! Considering where all this took place, Diane is lucky she didn’t get capital punishment. That damn truancy law was aimed at kids in a whole lot different situations, such as on-site parents who didn’t give a damn or weren’t able to control the kids. I did sign a petition in Diane’s favor. Helen, is there any way you could adopt her and the younger sibs?

  12. Ouch–I, who really tries to check things out, sure was willing to believe what Frankie Schaeffer had to say because it validated what I was predisposed to believe. Will look more closely. Thanks.

  13. This is so sad. A 17 year old honor student, has to work 2 jobs to support herself, a younger sibling and a brother in college. She gets a criminal record for missing school because she is exhausted. The judge is a Republican – such a caring and thoughtful fellow. So sad that he would do this.

    http://juanitajean.com/2012/05/27/do-like-mitt-said-if-you-dont-have-20000-to-start-your-business-borrow-it-from-your-dad/

  14. Now I grew up in the southeast. I have friends who are evangelical Christians. They are some of the best people I know and I’m lucky to have them in my life. But the theology is threatening. And the overlap of the theology with politics is very threatening. Again, I’m the first to admit when I’m operating out of emotion, not reason. But I tend to buy a lot of what Frankie Schaeffer says about the certain aspects of the evangelical movement.

    Interesting. I guess you do realize Frankie Schaeffer has also been debunked as a fraud by many if not most of father’s friends, acquaintances and his own mother? Frankie Schaeffer is in my book about as credible as Ronnie Reagan Jr talking about his old man. Frankie wouldn’t even qualify as prodigal son.

    And I think George Soros provides the perfect caricature of the James Bond villain. I can practically hear him saying in the private of Barack Obama’s company, “No Mr. Bond, I expect you to die!!!!! Buwahahahahaahaha” :smile: I don’t think Soros is evil – I know he is evil and for all intents and purposes communist thug. And that is the surrogate leader of your party, because he provides the bling necessary. The world will be better when Soros passes.

    I hope you do realize or someday will realize the Evangelicals minus Palin who you listed are more characters of the media than they are leaders of Evangelical Christianity. I consider those listed pretty much the fringe – they provide a convenient caricature on TV of how buffoonish a humanist media would like to project Evangelicals. Palin is a different case in that she’s first and foremost a pol. Pfesser and I have had these conversations before, and I assured him as I will assure you that as an Evangelical of many years, I held my breath every time Jerry Falwell or Pat Roberson came on TV, praying they didn’t say something else stupid I would be forced to defend. Cringe worthy, especially after 9/11 when I finally had enough and publicly lambasted them on their own websites telling them I thought they were a disgrace and certainly no asset to the cause.

    Tend to your garden and I will tend to mine after I clean the windows. :mad: Talk to you later and best to you and yours.

  15. and thank you for the compliment. Likewise.

  16. Tex: Glad to respond but announce in advance that this contains irrational and emotional elements. I am ok as a Jew with Obama but not for the reasons you might think. One of the first times in my adult life that I have ever felt imminently threatened was when McCain picked Sarah Palin as a running mate. Her acknowledged religious affiliations are ones that believe that anyone other than Christians are “doomed” to damnation. They also claim to support Israel but it is in the context of a belief system that includes the notion that it will be part of the end times, and the destruction of Jews. So my reaction to her was one of visceral fear.

    Actually, maybe it’s more accurate to say that I am less uncomfortable with Obama because I don’t see him lining up with a world view that views me and mine as of lesser value in an absolute sense. He may not be a “friend” to Israel, but there are others whose “friendship” I don’t want. I know where he stands and can live with that. And I can tell you with absolute certainty that I’m not alone as a Jew in this reaction. Jews didn’t run from McCain or towards Obama–Jews ran like hell from Sarah Palin. You have a Jew watch those videos of her being blessed by the African witch doctor and you have one scared Jew.

    Now I grew up in the southeast. I have friends who are evangelical Christians. They are some of the best people I know and I’m lucky to have them in my life. But the theology is threatening. And the overlap of the theology with politics is very threatening. Again, I’m the first to admit when I’m operating out of emotion, not reason. But I tend to buy a lot of what Frankie Schaeffer says about the certain aspects of the evangelical movement.

    As for Soros, he has many horrible flaws and has done many things with which I vehemently disagree. But I don’t think it’s accurate to call him a Nazi sympathizer and the story about him (at 14) being a “collaborator” has been pretty much debunked. Is he worse than Falwell was? I happen to view Falwell as a charlatan of the first order. What about Baker? Or Swaggert? Or Robertson? Or Fischer?

    OK–the Greek columns were ridiculous. Laughable. Puerile. Hold your nose-ish. Groan-worthy. And the speeches may pander and be manipulative–but so were the ones at the Republican convention. Again, at bottom, I can’t think of a politician that I trust or admire. I’m closer to the ideals that the Democrats espouse than to those that the Republicans do. I’d rather listen to a Bryan Schweitzer than a Rudy Guiliani. And sometimes it comes down to that.

    Garden beckons.

  17. “If Obama were as radical as they claim, here’s what he would have already done: Pulled the troops out of Afghanistan, given us ‘Medicare for all,’ ended the drug war, cut the defense budget in half, and turned Dick Cheney over to the Hague.”

    “If he’s a socialist, he’s a lousy one”

    PEACE ~ Δ

  18. .
    “Bullies are people, too!”

    Read the whole week. ;)

    PEACE ~ Δ

  19. Donna, I find it hard to believe as a Jew, you could find any favor in Barack Obama. He clearly is no friend to Israel. But then I never did understand that relationship to begin with. Worse, I am utterly amazed at what you just said about a Nazi sympathizer like George Soros – a convicted felon who is clearly a disciple of Marxism with ill intent. I would be curious who these “Evangelicals” are that you equate.

    But if you find no difference in landing a deck carrier to celebrate a victory of sorts deposing of Saddam (which by the way, the troops adored), to standing in front of Styrofoam columns spouting platitudes that can’t possibly be kept with clear delusions of divinity feigning control of the physical universe, then I can better understand why we are polar opposites. :shock: I’ll tell you the words that came to mind as I watched Barack Obama from his temple – no pun intended – The Abomination of Desolation. That was about a cultish display as I’ve witnessed in my lifetime, and certainly here in America. I knew then we had crossed the Rubicon as a country.

    Nonetheless, I still find you a step above fray here for what it is worth. At least you’re interesting, intelligent and have original thought. Many of these folks literally remind me of ‘Dear Leader’ material. That’s the honest truth.

  20. And when I say “evangelicals,” I am not basing my view on the religious beliefs but on the actions that some (not all) evangelical leaders have taken.

  21. Tex: I agree with you that the President is a narcissist. I can’t think of any President during my lifetime that I don’t consider a narcissist, or any candidate for the office (Ralph Nader? Ross Perot?). Congress is packed with narcissists of both parties and some that switch alliances for the purpose of being voted back in.

    But I’m not sure that George Soros is more “evil” than his counterparts on the right. Or that Ayers is any worse than some of the evangelicals that Republican candidates have courted and been influenced by. Or that Greek columns are sillier than the flight suit and the “Mission Accomplished” banner or some of the Reagan rhetoric.

    You see no core in Obama. I see no core in Romney. But then I see no core in pretty much any politician, including those of the party that more closely resembles my views. Currently reading the latest volume in the Robert Caro book about LBJ–you want to talk about a bumper crop of awfulness?

  22. Mitt RomneyBarack Hussein is a classic sociopath and malignant narcissist. The perpetual, charming, plastic smile. The shiny but soulless eyes. The willingness to brush off his own sadism with the wave of a hand…

    A man so full of himself, he thought it necessary to pen not one, but two autobiographies of himself before he reached the age of 40 assisted by an avowed domestic terrorist – practically unknown outside his circle of influence.

    A man with such delusions of grandeur he announced in front of Greek Columns as in temple on high, “”This was the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow, and our planet begin to heal.”

    There is absolutely no core to Barack Obama besides self. A Muslim in a mosque; black liberal theology of choice when politically expedient; Evangelical Christian in the black Baptist Churches of Alabama; secular humanist in the crowds of Hollywood, making accusation of bitter clingers. A consummate politician and narcissist by choice, groomed from an early age by true evil like George Soros.

    And you want to criticize Mitt Romney as a sociopath?

    Truly, you folk are so deluded, that it can be defined as nothing short of madness. I continue to confidently state that statist progressivism is clearly a mental illness and personally destructive.

  23. “This country is based on the fantasy that the government is the voice of the people. Going thru the motions of voting…is central to our culture.”

    PEACE ~ Δ

  24. Mitt Romney is a classic sociopath. The perpetual, charming, plastic smile. The shiny but soulless eyes. The willingness to brush off his own sadism with the wave of a hand…

    Yeah. Let’s remind the world why everyone thinks Americans are insane by putting this guy in the White House.

  25. Actually, Tex–the only times I mention things like grammar, spelling, or punctuation is when someone is particularly officious and condescending. Otherwise, I don’t even notice.

    I’m pretty critical of all politicians and dubious about all policies. I can’t imagine why anyone would want to go into politics and trust nobody who does. And I am cursed, partly by nature and partly by 30-plus years of doing what I do, by different sides of any story. I tend to push back at blanket statements about anything. (other than the sovereignty of Israel–my views about which you have correctly predicted).

    Enjoy your Sunday.

  26. I am laughing, Tex–I had that reaction, second guessed myself, and thought maybe it was equally correct. But you are right. Have a safe weekend, yourself.

    A weak stab at humor to gig you. You may have many frailties. But the common theme of M&H inanity is not one. :wink: They could use a few more like you with ability to intelligently engage and think critically, even if we do disagree. It certainly would raise the leftist mean IQ about 40 points if you were cloned.

    If we are to be scorched for grammar, punctuation, even the occasional spelling boo boo, I wouldn’t be allowed to post as I practically ignore all three.

    Have a nice remaining weekend.

  27. I am laughing, Tex–I had that reaction, second guessed myself, and thought maybe it was equally correct. But you are right. Have a safe weekend, yourself.

  28. and how about a source for the claim that Democrats’ “largest voting block” is illegal voters?

    When used in that matter, it’s referred by voting “bloc.” :grin: Have a safe Memorial Weekend, Donna.

    ———

    Cynthia, Lurker, J. Joe Bob? Anyone? The silence has been deafening.

    I’ve been waiting three days and not one lib has taken a stab at my argument your ‘Nutting’ article and his claims of Obama austerity is a crock on every level, and Obama is without question, the biggest spender by far to ever reside in the White House.

    Hopefully, we’ve put that argument to rest and you M&H plebes can move on to the next bald faced lie to contest. I’ll consider the claim busted, unless I hear otherwise.

  29. well- we had poor old Joe using other people’s work computers to vote for himself multiple times in the attempt to advance himself within his party… amongst all the other idiot things he has done

    http://www.alaskadispatch.com/article/stress-lies-and-politics-tainted-joe-millers-borough-job-records-show

    and now he’s trying to reinvent himself as mr clean elections himself

  30. Excellent, Cynthia. I believe that the response will be the Cosmo Kramer approach: “It’s a well-known fact.” Always so persuasive.

  31. My sincerest apology for not believing there is a problem with Massive Voter Fraud. I stand corrected.

    An investigation revealed a voter had voted a total of 365 times!

    http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/01/11/massive-vote-fraud-nullifies-hawk-name-contest/

    Peace.

  32. oh, and how about a source for the claim that Democrats’ “largest voting block” is illegal voters? Last I checked, it tended to be a mix of highly educated people, certain geographic areas, many blue collar workers, Catholics, Jews, and other groups whose legitimacy is not in question. But what an easy and cheap shot to make.

  33. How adorable. Noah/Nagic demonstrating how it is that he never makes personal attacks (unless he is attacked first). Nope, just those nasty liberals do that. I guess it doesn’t count that he calls us “hags” and “sheople.” Such intellectual discourse.

    p.s. When used in that manner, it’s “affects” not “effects.”

  34. I do love how people try and muddy the water. If we have a problem with people making false I.D.’s, great, that is another topic. Despite what the hags on here want you to believe, not everyone making below 75k a year is a Liberal looking for a handout. Voter I.D. is being able to able to have a way to visually inspect someone to ascertain if they are who they say they are. You sheople think if you can find one flaw it invalidates the entire premise.

    I do not care if it makes it harder to vote. Republicans and Democrats alike are equally effected. Making it a partisan issue is the Liberal way of saying they have no logical reason other than the truth which is to allow their largest voting block, illegal voters, to continue voting.

    As for Cynthia’s claim that voter fraud isn’t an issue, say it one more time and I will post pages of issues in just the last couple of elections. We all know a Liberal has no issue with winning by cheating, so lets just call it what it is and move on.

  35. Have a wonderful Memorial Day weekend, Helen and Margaret and all the porch visitors and dwellers. Thanks to all who have sacrificed to preserve liberty. Now if we could only take it back and hold onto it…

  36. Also there is a you tube that gives a better accounting than the AF http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkl0gV7epsI&feature=share

  37. http://www.change.org/petitions/police-shooting-needs-fair-investigation

  38. Hi! We had some trouble with a bully here in Loxahatchee Groves Fl. An undercover cop parked in my friend’s driveway. When Seth Adams came home he was shot 4 times by the cop. He died. Report by the Sheriff tried to make Seth out to be an aggressor;some people who didn’t know Seth might believe that, however those of us who did know him knew it was a cover up..We have a petition and we have been advised to let people on blogs know of this…so I am asking for you to sign the petition and to help circulate it, if that is not too much trouble.Thanks Margaret , Helen, Alaskapi, JuneauJoe & all here.

  39. Cynthia- thanks! Will go and read it soon. Have to go into work for awhile now.
    Snow is melted below 1000 ft but weeks of cold rain and daytime temps averaging 8-12 degrees below normal for this time of year have kinda punched a hole in enjoying the lack of snow so far – dang.
    However, using double row covers on outdoor veggies (and chasing covers and frames of low hoop houses all over the ridge here in the wind :-) ) I now have spinach and greens to eat everyday with kales, turnips, pac choi, broccoli, and so on coming along nicely as well. Truly fresh food counts for a lot. Wildflowers slowly coming on and fish starting to run counts for a lot too. Life is good, chilly but good.
    Have a good weekend

  40. Alaskapi

    http://www.west.senate.state.tx.us/pr12/p031212a.htm

    …”Department of Justice – Voting Rights Division (DOJ), that changes made to Texas elections laws that would require voters to show a state-approved form of photo identification to vote have been rejected….
    .. In other words, the new law would make it harder for minority citizens to vote than the existing requirements already set in state law.”…
    The other states face similar reasons for oversight/rejection.
    IMO it is not really about…..OMG Massive Voter Fraud!!!

    Has the snow melted yet??

  41. http://www.justice.gov/crt/about/vot/sec_5/about.php

    This is the section TX was denied something under. Congress reauthorized the oversight for another 25 years in 2006. I don’t, again, know what TX was trying to do.
    We just got a semi-ok for redistricting after the 2010 census here to be able to have the state know what districts are ( for now) so people can file for state seats for primary . As redistricting means every seat in the state legislature but one ( my Senator) is up to vote this year the time frame , State Supreme court rulings, DOJ rulings , and all have been quite a spectacle and really do not have a final plan – just an interim one to manage the coming primary and general elections under.
    I worry about all that more than I worry about phony voters- here.

  42. have a great weekend everyone…..

  43. UAW- oh . ok. I misread something there that you said then.
    We are also an under-DOJ -oversight state along with Texas and 7 or 8 other states who have had routine problems with meeting federal law under the Civil Rights Act of 1965.
    I am not familiar with what the problems are in TX and the other states which got them under DOJ oversight but I am very familiar with why we are.
    Ours has to do with districting and Alaska Natives and the mighty battle here as relates to urban v rural. Very long, very involved and good that fed got involved ( jeez- did I just say that ? ).
    If those other states did/do what happened here or similar kinds of voter disenfranchisement stuff, then they have work to do to get off the radar , just like we do.

  44. well anon- this where my libertarian side comes out. Why and when did we get so comfortable about ID for everything we do?
    That being said, Folks who want false ID will get it whether it is to vote or to do business. We should hop right on making discovery and proof of those false IDs and extract penalties but I don’t think illegal aliens and, here, felons, wanting to vote is the largest problem with voting problems.
    Crappy maintenance of the rolls is and sometimes, crappy management of the actual election like what happened in ANC last month- where under stocking ballots at polling places and such things alongside poll workers ending people all over the city to find ballots and vote questioned ballots outside their precincts and the like made for a SNAFU which is just disgusting. muncipal clerk has resigned and asst clerk in charge of election was fired but MOA ( unified City and Borough of Anchorage) is looking to rewrite election code so that cannot happen again.
    Problem wasn’t the voters, problem was the elections division.

  45. alaskapi?????????
    I didn’t think the Feds were trying to invoke voter ID laws…I thought the states were…….at least we agree that “something” needs to be done……back to your article it’s the DOJ(the Feds) that is trying to supersede state laws(Texas)….
    still wondering why JJ has a problem with purging dead people and/or live people that have no right to vote in that area……(notice how I didn’t say Illegal aliens/illegal,immigrants)……
    So JJ….should there be ANY restrictions on voting or should everybody be allowed to vote as many times and wherever they want……(got a local millage issue I can vote on in your area???????)(send me 20 absentee ballots please)…..

  46. We require nothing less than a photo I.D. to…..
    1. Boarding an airplane
    2. Writing a check
    3. Cashing a check
    4. Using a credit card
    5. Driving a motor vehicle
    6. Applying for a business license
    7. Applying for permission to hold a protest or rally
    8. Securing employment
    9. Purchasing a house or real estate
    10. Renting a domicile
    11. Renting a motor vehicle
    12. Purchasing a firearm (Includes BB guns)
    13. Applying for a hunting license (waived for 16 and 17 year olds when their legal guardian provides a photo ID)
    14. Applying for a fishing license (waived for 16 and 17 year olds when their legal guardian provides a photo ID)
    15. Purchasing alcoholic beverages
    16. Purchasing tobacco or products that contain nicotine
    17. Purchasing a motor vehicle
    18. Initial registration of a motor vehicle
    19. Applying for a building permit
    20. Receiving prescription medicine
    21. Purchasing OTC medicine that contains pseudoephedrine
    22. Serving on jury duty
    23. Getting a bank account
    24. Cash transactions of $5000.00 or greater
    25. Sales tax exemption for people aged 80 and above

    Of the above, numbers 2, 3 and 4 are not state law but at a business owners discretion. By law, they can demand it. Numbers 15, 16 and 25 are usually applied using common sense, as in if you appear to be too young the business can demand proof and refuse to engage in the activity if one cannot provide proof of the required age law.

    All of the above are things that occur on a daily basis but not necessarily to everybody.

    Despite the above common actions that people engage in, some seem to think that asking for a photo ID for voting purposes is somehow a violation of civil liberties or an attempt to prevent people from voting. The really interesting part is that it is usually liberals claiming that it is conservatives attempting to prevent people from voting when a photo ID law would apply equally to both liberals and conservatives. Heck, they would apply equally regardless of age, gender, ethnicity, weight, sexual orientation, income, health, disability, race, wealth, intelligence, marital status, attractiveness, employment status and everything else. Is there something wrong with preventing the dead, the illegal aliens, the young (under the age of suffrage) and other non-qualified people from voting just as we prevent them from engaging in the activities listed above?

  47. I am not against showing ID to vote. Most states require some form of identification at this time. The ‘poll tax’ I was referring to the requirement of a photo ID as a condition for voting. Not every one has a photo ID or a copy of their birth certificate. For example Wisconsin’s requirements for a FREE state ID is a certified U.S. birth certificate, or valid passport or certificate of naturalization and the state ID must be obtained at the DMV service center. A copy of a BC may cost $25-$35. IMO this is a poll tax. You of course may see it differently.

    BTW do you look like the picture on your driver’s license or passport??

    State’s Voter Identification Requirements

    http://www.ncsl.org/legislatures-elections/elections/voter-id.aspx

    It is a beautiful weekend…….take a break and enjoy it.

    Peace.

  48. UAW-
    while people can register to vote in their community it is the state who manages the voter rolls.
    It appears the state purges rolls in March these last few years but that November election showed way too many who didn’t get purged who should have. I have been trying to find out what criteria the state uses to purge besides death notices and re-registration in another precinct and not gotten very far yet.
    Another non-open and transparent govt process to try to ferret out details on… sigh.

  49. UAW- there’s still a lot of the in the living room-office type registering here in bush communities or village tribal offices and the like. ( When I paid off my truck the DMV office which issued the new reg and ownership slip was someone’s kitchen :-) )
    Given the isolated circumstances of these places birth certs are still the preferred method of registering though folks in the big city use passports and other IDs to register.

    A funny but true side note-
    as there are multiple legal ramifications, way more so than registering falsely to vote, for falsely obtaining resident hunting and-or fishing licenses here one’s license may be used to establish residency to qualify to register.
    Fish and Game routinely nails folks who lie to get licenses- the fines and all are ginormous. Elections Division seems to rely on ADFG to police voter rolls in some ways…?

    And here all these IDs are valid for voting :

    “When entering your polling place, the election worker will ask you for a piece of identification. The following documents may be used for identification:

    signed voter ID card, driver’s license, state ID card, or military ID card;

    passport, hunting or fishing license; or

    other current or valid photo identification. ”

    http://www.elections.alaska.gov/vi_hv_vote_polls.php

    I think we cover the bases ok here for knowing whether someone is entitled to vote at the time of voting . We haven’t done a very good job of keeping up with the actual lists and rolls and all.

  50. so Alaskapi….did they purge the voters list up there yet?….or are there court orders stopping the purge/or complaints from other areas that stopped the purge……or is the village/township/borough clerk not doing their job…..

  51. UAW- mostly folks in the bush use birth certificates to register and that can be done various ways which do not require big trips.
    It is the question of whether picture ID supercedes the voter ID card at the time of voting which I am talking about.
    Why has the argument turned away from voter ID cards which are issued by the state after registration processes to producing picture ID independant of that voter ID at the time of voting?
    Dead people who can produce their voter ID card at the time of voting ? More power to them…

  52. lol anon- you and your all/none routine…

    I don’t care what the rest of the states do to solve their voter issues- that it is the purview of the states to manage is the point you missed.And the basis of most current arguments and attempts at laws to require picture ID.
    Should Congress decide to step in as regards federal elections . they would be treading some interesting ground but at this point there is no big push for them to do so.

    And you would be surprised how many communities here have no store ( all goods are flown or barged in by individuals themselves) so seeing ID for tobacco sales is a different critter than you know. And how many communities have no vehicles larger than 4 wheelers or snowmachines – we have no roads as you know them in most of the state. Kotzebue is having a cow because they now have a few miles of road and enough vehicles that the state is enforcing reg and insurance laws along with driver’s licensing :-)
    And how many communities are dry by law so ID for alcohol is a moot point though tracking bootleggers is a big deal- including watching how much sugar and yeast people have sent in :-)

    I think states need to get their acts together on voter rolls and oversight and that we don’t get all liberal and feddy and all and require the fed to oversee one more nanny-state dealie in a federal voter ID law- are you saying you are “liberal”enough to want one more federal hoo-bobby?

    If so- then yes, I’m all for the rest of the country being based on hicksville :-)
    The billions and billions of dollars generated by resources in hicksville power this whole state.
    The liberal one man, one vote SCOTUS decision a number of years back effectively silenced rural Alaska and rural America and i’m up for whatever rocks that boat til we get it evened out again.

    hippie commie liberal most of the time hicksville Pi

  53. Alaskapi……..
    apparently everyone up there at one time or another had to register to vote….that means at least one trip to whereever it is you register at….in Mi. it’s at the Secretary of States office….cost=$0.00……40+ years ago it was to the township clerks office(usually his living room)…..like Mageen I got a voter registration card…….now we use drivers licenses…..big deal…….you have 2000 registered voters in an area the size of W Virginia……..and Florida has 53,000 dead voters………if the dead can show a license let them vote……

  54. Gov Scott Walker had an anemic performance in his recent debate – hip, hip, hooray!

    http://www.politiscoop.com/us-politics/wisconsin-politics/1415-walker-crawls-into-shell-after-anemic-debate-performance.html

  55. I was wondering alaskapi
    So all of these people in your state dont drive, dont buy tobacco, dont drink? Or are you all just breaking the law and dont want to give up this perk? And really, do you want to have the rest of the nation be based on hicksville?

  56. alaskapi
    So all of these people in your state dont drive, dont buy tobacco, dont drink? Or are you all just breaking the law and dont want to give up this perk? And really, do you want to have the rest of the nation be based on hicksville?

  57. UAW- since you asked in honesty:

    http://blog.constitutioncenter.org/2012/03/are-voter-id-laws-constitutional-and-are-they-a-good-idea/

    Recently I was part of an independant observer group for an historical election here- though my contribution was tiny in the overall picture, it was enlightening on a number of fronts to me.

    It is a borough in which all voting is done by mail,for borough business, as it encompasses an area almost the size of West Virginia and has fewer than 2000 residents including children. For state and federal elections , hand counts or touch screens are employed at sites set up within the communities.
    Nowhere in any of these communities can one get a state approved ID (including getting/renewing a driver’s license which is not needed locally but is if folks go to the big city. The big city is a plane ride and many hundreds of dollars away) as the state doesn’t deem them large enough to warrant the expense of running an office to do those things.This is fairly common in the state once you get away from ANC, FBX, and JNU.People get their voter state ID cards by filing copies of birth certificates as often as not.

    Previous to the election it was obvious that the borough’s voter rolls were very out of date and well overdue for a purge as there were more names on it than resident inhabitants in the entire borough including children and pets.

    It is an area which swells with seasonal fishing activities by at least 10 fold for about 12 weeks in the summer and given 30 day residency rules the state has for registration has certainly added to the voter rolls.

    It seemed quite obvious as things unfolded that it was mostly the lack of will and /or process by the STATE to follow up and purge the rolls of deceased and left-the-area folks which was at base of the swollen rolls.
    I have seen that working on elections in my area too. I enter data into vote-builder , a program which shows ALL registered voters, regardless of party affiliation in local precincts. Over and over I see names of folks I know don’t live in the area anymore.
    I have talked to state election people about all this. While there are numerous checks and balances to keeping folks from voting more than once or from more than one place (which worked quite well in the election I observed ) I think Alaska needs a real and abiding system to keep rolls up to date.
    That is the purview of the individual states- not the fed, though the fed can weigh in on rules for federal seats like Reps and Pres.
    Picture ID at the time of voting ? Not really needed here . We do tend to know each other and state voter card is adequate for finding folks on the lists.
    If Congress were to weigh in on the federal level for federal elections and try to require it? Bad news for most of this state and just more one-size-fits-all tyranny of the metropolitan majority. And pffft! on that.

  58. New Rules

  59. Even tho I think Bill Mahar is a asshat I still laughed my ass off about the Romney Wifer clip…..

  60. I am Backgammon, have always been Backgammon and have never used any other name on any site. But thank you for further disinformation.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/forget-bain-obamas-public-equity-record-is-the-real-scandal/2012/05/24/gJQAXnXCnU_story.html?wpisrc=emailtoafriend

  61. Mitt Romney is a WIFER!! He has multiple wives and kids from 5 of them.
    He strapped his dog to his car because his car was full of wives for that trip to Canada. Why is he only showing the short version of his marriage certificate? WE MUST SEE THE LONG VERSION.

    http://rackjite.com/bill-maher-leader-of-the-wifer-movement-romneys-mormon-wives/

  62. Since you did not have the courage to explain why we card for alcohol or tobacco or how you are for our government demanding we prove our health coverage but not our identity to vote.

    You won’t get an answer to that Anon, anymore then I did about my counter argument demonstrating these claims of Austerity President is as big a farce as that Chatty Kitchen place all the nags run back to after we’ve deposed of their abject stupidity.

    A very legitimate, very simple question of which Cynthia will have no answer because there is no rational answer to oppose voter ID other than to cheat – these urban centers are ballot stuffing machines, assisted by ACORN and the like. ACORN didn’t get their federal funding yanked for being Boy Scouts.

    Cynthia and some of her soul sisters here are a small part of a larger cult called Leftism – every bit the cult that sharia is, only this is driven by statism and the sacrament of aborting children instead of Allah. Their entire miserable existence is invested in the Cult of Obama currently – subject to change if they can swing a better package of freebies and right to personal irresponsibility.

    Then you get some stooge like Juneau who spends hours each day plastering the current talking points from the same feckless, uber progressive blogs by instinct, like a robin building a nest to lay eggs. Complete reactionary reflex and always predictable. I doubt the man has ever had an original thought.

    Unfortunately, our Republic has one fatal flaw – it assumes a citizenry informed and intelligent to vote for society’s best interests. When half the country doesn’t pay a dime of federal tax, you can buy a vote. And that is exactly what the Great Society has wrought.

    Sixteen trillion dollars of welfare later, and we’ve got multi-generational buffoons, helpless and dependent upon their nanny gov’t.

  63. lol, noah/nagic/anon, truly lol :-)
    Your so-called point is moot- truly not relevant, has no value nor meaning .
    It doesn’t matter to me whether anyone insulted you or you insulted them .
    I did and still do think dirty tricks like those the Black Irish pulled stunk- whether pointed at you or anyone else.
    Beyond that- pfft.
    Calling someone a shitbrick or any of the other skooky things you’ve called people pretty much makes your so-called point irrelevant , regardless of who said what first or whether the first volley was really an insult or not.
    It has all devolved into endless silliness, this thing you keep calling your point.

    Dear Helen and Margaret-
    thank you for having us all in.
    I mean it. Really.

  64. Ahh I do love a spot of failed speculation in the early morning. As you can see Pi. farsight goes for the personal attack as I predicted he would. Its all you Libs got. As always it is a good thing that farsight superior insight was there to explain to all the other people who he feels is far less intelligent than he, and thus in need of his brilliant deductions.

    Why talk about meaningful topics when we have shitbricks like farsight to spend all his evenings talking about me.

  65. saying the same thing over and over doesnt make it anymore true than before……that is all.

  66. Argyle, my research shows that Backgammon arrived about May 11th. Nagic got shitcanned on May 15th (he discusses/whines about it on Rutherford’s) and returned several days later as anonymous. I believe he may have been masquerading as Backgammon from the 11th. Backgammon’s style and redundant noxious posts fits part of the nagic MO. I think nagic/anonymous could very well be using the Backgammon persona to bolster his disinformation campaign. Noah/nagic/hydra’s past history of repetitive juvenile behavior here on M & H would tend to bolster this position.

    He has an incredible fascination with this blog and derives an a considerable amount of his self worth by posting here. Most of the regulars who have commented on it, think it’s a decidedly sick behavior. Once you follow nagic/anonymous and Backgammon, I believe you may very well the degree to which they undermine their stated cause. I’m relatively certain they/he haven’t a clue. When it works for him he states that he is trying to stir up liberals, and when that doesn’t work for him, he changes his tune and says he just likes to stir up liberals.

  67. New Rules: Ted Nugent and the current Republican mess, Good

    http://rackjite.com/new-rules-with-bill-maher-what-is-ted-nugent-mad-about-may-25-2012/

  68. Ok nagic, I’m going to break my rule about talking to the troll. Quit being being your normal asshole self and go back to the thread and read it. I do believe that some people got their feathers in a ruffle and overreacted to Rutherford. However, Rutherford basically outed himself by his reaction. Had he left it alone, I don’t believe anyone would have know who —- was referring to.

    You continue to be an inflamed ass and will continue to continue regardless of what I do or don’t relate to you. I’m sure you will continue smeagol.

  69. You will take note that every time Jo has to think for himself rather than post links to someone else who does his thinking for him, he has to go back to GW Bush for a retort. So cut Jo some slack, not exactly playing with a full deck.

  70. Backgammon, you seem so familiar.

  71. You libs just keep forgetting George Bush is no longer President, he can not ever run for President again. Bush is history, Obama is running for President and brags about being in a drug daze his last two years of high school. Smoking Pot, doing some blow…..that’s what I want my grandkids to admire.

  72. Speaking of Drugs: How is GW Bush doing these days? SNORT, SNORT

    Here is one of the people purged off the Florida voter rolls. The Republicans want to purge 180,000. Guess What: They are Democrats or minorities to be purged – SURPRISE? Not really. Just the Republican way of stealing elections.
    Maureen Russo was born in Akron, Ohio. For the last 40 years she’s operated a dog boarding and grooming business — Bobbi’s World Kennels — with her husband in Ft. Lauderdale, Florida. Maureen is 60 years old and has been a registered voter in the state for the last four decades. She regularly votes at the church around the corner from her home.
    Two weeks ago she received a letter from the State of Florida informing her that that had recieved information that she was not born in this country and, therefore, was ineligible to vote.

    http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/05/25/490678/eligible-florida-voter-governor-rick-scott-purged/

  73. jacy
    Yes better to have a crack addict who spent his years in college in a drug induced haze, hanging around known terrorists, socialists and communists, than a school bully. I have to say you have your priorities in a f*cked up order. .

  74. farsight Δ
    bla bla bla. Why is it when it is a Liberal that does the crime, you and your kind explain it away as being the victim’s fault. A Republican farts downwind if you and you want to execute his family for the offense. How about taking responsibility and say “It Was Wrong” ?

  75. He gathered a group of students. They tackled a younger student and while that student cried and screamed for help, Mitt Romney, the assumed Republican nominee for President, cut off his hair because he didn’t like the way he looked. Does it matter if that student was gay? Would it be worse if he was black? How about if that student were a woman? I don’t give a rat’s ass if that student were all three. One in three hundred million. One. tHAT SAYS IT ALL! WHO REALLY CARES IF THE KID WAS GAY, STRAIGHT , BLACK, WHITE ,RED,YELLOW , BROWN OR GREEN! MALE, FEMALE OR ANYTHING IN BETWEEN! IT’S ALL WRONG TO TREAT ANY PERSON LIKE THAT! ONE IN THREE HUNDRED MILLION! NOT THE PERSON I WANT AS MY PRESIDENT!

  76. UAW,

    James spends a lot of time over on Rutherford’s as near as I can tell. I only lurk there. Anonymous/nagic/noah spends a fair amount of time there and so does Pfesser. Rutherford’s denizens spend a fair number of posts bashing M & H. Rutherford claims to be a liberal, but to my thinking he is right of center, a moderate at best. He was supposedly outed here back in 2011. I went back and reviewed the posts. It is my take that he has himself to blame as much as —- for outing him. She only mentioned his last name in an obscure reference, and had he not gone hermatile, it is my belief that no one would have known who —- was referring to.

  77. what ever happened to James???????/How’s crops in Iowa…..

  78. [...] is an excellent comment on the story by Ruth Marcus at WaPo.  And then there are the inimitable Margaret and Helen with their usual wise and witty commentary, seeing through Mitt’s excuses (h/t MrsTBB). *** [...]

  79. It just says everything that there is to say about the Liberal party that they would block any and all means to ensure a “fair” and “accurate” vote.

  80. starting to think that we need to dip our finger in ink when we vote…….if you try to vote again you get slapped upside the c&cksucker…….or shot….works in Afganistan and Iraq……even Egypt……

  81. That about sums it up.

  82. so explain to me how the simple act of having the ability to visually identify someone disenfranchises an entire group Cynthia. Since you did not have the courage to explain why we card for alcohol or tobacco or how you are for our government demanding we prove our health coverage but not our identity to vote.

  83. And this one I found extremely interesting…lays out in detail.

    http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Interesting_ALEC_Quotes

    The late Paul Weyrich helped Eric Heubeck pen a radical-right manifesto in 2001.

    …”There will be three main stages in the unfolding of this movement. The first stage will be devoted to the development of a highly motivated elite able to coordinate future activities. The second stage will be devoted to the development of institutions designed to make an impact on the wider elite and a relatively small minority of the masses. The third stage will involve changing the overall character of American popular culture…”

    …….”We will use guerrilla tactics to undermine the legitimacy of the dominant regime. We will take advantage of every available opportunity to spread the idea that there is something fundamentally wrong with the existing state of affairs. … contribute to a vague sense of uneasiness and dissatisfaction with existing society. … We need to break down before we can build up. We must first clear away the flotsam of a decayed culture.”….

    But of course you know this…..correct?

    Peace

  84. Massive voter fraud….really? Source Please. I think you mean massive election fraud.

    This is a part of what it is about…….Paul Weyrich and ALEC’s Voter ID legislation.
    “Now many of our Christians have what I call the goo-goo syndrome — good government. They want everybody to vote. I don’t want everybody to vote. Elections are not won by a majority of people, they never have been from the beginning of our country and they are not now. As a matter of fact, our leverage in the elections quite candidly goes up as the voting populace goes down.”
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GBAsFwPglw
    http://www.nationofchange.org/…/patriots-are-suppressing-2012-voter-turn...

    It is a poll tax. I am sure if the Republicans had won in 2008 there would NOT be one word or action about voter fraud today. IMO the Republicans could not win on their policies/agenda with the majority of voters even the average Republican so cheating is their only option.

    Peace.

  85. Damn Cynthia is even three days behind Obama’s waterboys. They laid that claim of austerity in the trash bin of history, Cynthia. Fifty million more people laughed those claims out of existence, and even the sycophants choked.

    Only one reason to be against voter ID. One only. Scares Dimocrats to death too that they might not be able to capitalize on the core voting bloc of the resurrected.

    It’s called voter fraud – Dimocrat’s specialty and another reason Obama is in big trouble. You’ll have to count on the union goons and black panthers this go around to sustain the rampant cheating.

  86. Well, dog my cats! Where I come from we have always had voter ID. Its called a voter registration card. I got mine when I registered to vote and carry it with me always and present it when I show up at the polls. The governor of this state (VA) has gone and duplicated something that wasn’t really necessary. He is sending everyone of voting age in the state who are already registered another type of voter ID card. Where he is getting the money to do this is beyond me, especially when the same money is needed much more for other things such as education, transporation, etc. But, hey, thats they way its done around here.

  87. Considering all the massive amounts of voter fraud and people voting who should not be, I do not understand the logic Democrats have in their objection to requiring people to show an I.D. to vote in our next leader of our nation. I can think of few acts a person can do that so greatly effects our nation. Should we not treat it as something that most consider a sacred duty?

    Government wants every citizen to prove they are insured, but they don’t have to prove they are a citizen? We require an I.D. to purchase tobacco and alcohol, but not to vote? Explain to me how this makes sense.

  88. Whirled Peas

    Probably the most misleading statement you have made in years. Lets not forget 9/11. Lets not forget the creation of Homeland Security. Some of that growth was necessary. Few of us Reagan Republicans liked Bush. But to say, as you Libs always do, “hey look at Bush, this is why you need to vote for Obama” No thinking person is going to buy it.

    Lets strip away all the politics, all your fancy Bernie Madoff accounting, and look at the debt when Obama took office, and look at where its at today. We cannot afford another 4 years of his, or your, creative accounting. Period!

  89. UAW –
    IMO – Illegal and dead people should be taken off the voter rolls. However, I don’t think dead people voting are a problem. There is enough to get live legal voters out to the polls. How do you get enough people to stand in line to vote for themselves and then stand in line to vote for someone else, not be recognized and keep it a secret?

    You may be celebrating that legal Democrats are being denied their right to vote but realize we are a democracy/Republic. IF one group of people is being denied their right to vote it is no longer a democracy/Republic. Understand you are loosing your rights as well.

    Standing in/writing in for another voter is too costly, too involved and subject to leaks. It is much easier to privatize the voting process and use electronic voting machines. The software is protected and prevents inspection. Much easier to manipulate the results by computer and fewer people involved. Like 2004 in Ohio for example. If that should fail there are always the Supremes to turn to for help.

    Peace.

  90. Keep ‘em comin’ M&H.
    .
    .
    Now for the rest of you Δ’s…
    .
    Honey I shrunk the government!!!
    .
    If you look at the full chart, back to George HW Bush, you reach an inescapable conclusion: the biggest spenders and borrowers are Republicans and the most fiscally conservative presidents have been Democrats. Given the last two decades, the Tea Party, if they really want to shrink government, should be voting for Obama.
    .
    Andrew Sullivan
    .
    PEACE ~ Δ

  91. LMAO…..

    Forget Bain — Obama’s public-equity record is the real scandal

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/forget-bain-obamas-public-equity-record-is-the-real-scandal/2012/05/24/gJQAXnXCnU_story.html

  92. Cynthia……..That’s what I get for assuming things……I didn’t know that JJ was complaining about all the Republican votes being lost…..my bad….

    but…

    “Florida’s quest to identify and remove non-U.S. citizens from the voter rolls was started at the direct urging of Gov. Rick Scott, the state’s former top elections official said.”
    “The state’s initial list — compiled by comparing driver’s licenses with voter registration data — showed that as many as 182,000 registered voters were eligible to be in the country but ineligible to vote.”

    Non U.S. citizens shouldn’t be on the voter rolls……and neither should the 53,000 dead people……….something that Ed Schulz forgot…..

  93. Castro, the daughter of Cuban President Raúl Castro and niece of Fidel, made the endorsement at a gay rights conference in California where she was speaking, the Miami Herald reported.

    “I would vote for President Obama. I think he’s sincere and speaks from the heart,” she said.

    Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/05/24/romney-calls-on-obama-to-reject-castro-endorsement/#ixzz1vtqTqwXO

  94. jeez JJ…
    can’t you get anymore fair and balanced……the crooks and liars are using current TV……….???????

  95. Hey UAW –

    I read that article three times and no where it was stated they were Democratic voters!

    Sorry about giving you the wrong info on deleting word press emails.

    Peace.

  96. ONLY IN THE USA: PRO-DEATH PENALTY, PRO-TORTURE, AND PRO LIFE! The numbers actually show people are Pro-Choice.

    http://videocafe.crooksandliars.com/heather/john-fugelsang-only-america-can-you-be-pro

  97. yep….. 53,000 dead Democrat voters…….
    remember the Dem chant…..VOTE EARLY-VOTE OFTEN

  98. dead voters purged in Florida…..53,000 of them…

    http://pjmedia.com/jchristianadams/2012/05/16/53000-dead-voters-found-in-florida/

  99. The Purging of Democratic, Independent and minority voters has started.
    Florida is out to purge 180,000 voters. Stealing an election by purging. Did this happen before? Let me think??? I kind of remember something similar.

    http://videocafe.crooksandliars.com/heather/ed-schultz-brings-national-attention-flori

  100. UAW- yup -TMI!
    Now don’t be getting mumpit wi’ mirds and mockery neither my friend-
    :-)

  101. Well Jo its to go with having the highest corporate tax rate in the world, as well as the largest debt in the world. We are a country of number 1’s. At least we know Bush didnt cause most of this debt right Jo?

  102. Sponsor a uterus!! $24.00 per month.

  103. Drug Company Fraud!! Why do we in the US have the highest drug prices in the world when compared to other countries??? Explained here. (BTW: We have the drug companies paying off those that make the laws.)

  104. LMAO…..

    A young guy from Saskatchewan moves to Vancouver and goes to a big ‘everything under one roof’ department store looking for a job. The Manager says, ‘Do you have any sales experience?’

    The kid says ‘Yeah. I was a salesman back in Saskatchewan.’

    Well, the boss liked the kid and gave him the job. ‘You start tomorrow. I’ll come down after we close and see how you did.’

    His first day on the job was rough, but he got through it. After the store was locked up, the boss came down. How many customers bought something from you today?

    ‘Just one’ says the kid.

    The boss says ‘Just one? Our salespeople average 20 to 30 customers a day. How much was the sale for?’

    The kid says $101,237.65′.

    The boss says ‘$101,237.65? What the heck did you sell?’

    The kid says, ‘First, I sold him a small fishhook. Then I sold him a medium fishhook. Then I sold him a larger fishhook. Then I sold him a new fishing rod. Then I asked him where he was going fishing and he said down the coast, so I told him he was going to need a boat, so we went down to the boat department and I sold him a twin engine Chris Craft. Then he said he didn’t think his Honda Civic would pull it, so I took him down to the automotive department and sold him that 4×4 Expedition.’

    The boss said ‘A guy came in here to buy a fish hook and you sold him a BOAT and a TRUCK?’

    The kid said ‘No, the guy came in here to buy Tampons for his wife’, and I said, ‘Dude, your weekend’s shot. You should go fishing.

  105. OOPS……. TMI….(to much info)

  106. well Delurker….you can tell Newbride anything she wants to hear but you haven’t fooled me…..
    Alaskapi…..this is new to me…….I never really thought of myself as a superstud but according to her older sister??????????YEA????????my tongue still gets stiff!!!!!!!!
    don’t really give-a-f$ck if that statement bothers Delurker……or newbe…..

  107. Could someone explain to me again all the ways OWS is superior to the Tea Party?

  108. It is the Soldier

    It is the soldier, not the reporter,
    Who gives us the freedom of press.
    It is the solider, not the poet,
    Who gives us the freedom of speech.

    It is the soldier, not the campus organizer,
    Who has given us the freedom to demonstrate.
    It is the soldier, not the lawyer,
    Who has given us the right to a fair trial.

    It is the soldier, who salutes the flag,
    Who serves under the flag,
    And whose coffin is draped by the flag
    Who allows the protester to burn the flag.

    Charles M. Province

    Enjoy the weekend!

    Peace.

  109. Good on the email onslaught getting stopped and GOOD on the younger woman companion ( jeez- when did 52 get to be younger? sounds positively wet behind the ears to me anymore. yikes. ) UAW.
    I’m guessing , if truth be told, the gal has to do some jogging to keep up with you :-)
    Really am watching this unfold-

    http://www.alaskadispatch.com/article/birth-murder-plot-laid-out-alaska-militia-trial

    Even for this guns everywhere and anti-govt state, these guys are over the top.Sovereign citizen’s movement, renouncing US citizenship, claiming to be foreign diplomats of their solitary selves, common law trial in Denny’s…
    Even for us, they are weird. Remains to be seen if they also crossed the line from stupenagle posturing to outright murder plots but kinda looking like it at this point…

  110. “We Will NOT Go Back to the 50s” Vice President Joe Biden is warming up for the election. This is great!! Joe speaks for the middle class.

    http://videocafe.crooksandliars.com/david/biden-rips-romneys-social-policy-we-will-not

  111. Reagan’s OMB Director, David Stockman, explains what is wrong with the Bain Capital (Mitt Romney) way of leveraging businesses as a means to make money for a few. Mitt Romney WAS NOT a job creator.

    … I don’t think Mitt Romney can legitimately say that he learned anything about how to create jobs in the LBO business. The LBO business is about how to strip cash out of old, long-in-the-tooth companies and how to make short-term profits.

    http://videocafe.crooksandliars.com/heather/former-omb-director-stockman-romney-cant-s

  112. Well Newbride, it didn’t hurt me a bit to be kind. If it bounced off and hit the floor, it doesn’t reflect on me. Thanks for looking out for me though.

    Time for a full day of yard work. Not everyone’s idea of a vacation day but it’ll be satisfying to get it done. Have a good day all.

  113. How The GOP Killed Washington: Guilty as Charged!

    It’s rare that a criminal publicly announces his intent to commit a felony. But when it came to their scorched-earth campaign of obstructionism to destroy the Obama presidency, GOP leaders weren’t shy about their plans. While 15 top Republicans schemed in private on the night of Obama’s inauguration to “challenge them on every single bill and challenge them on every single campaign,” conservative mouthpieces like Bill Kristol and Rush Limbaugh promised gridlock at every turn.

    From its record-setting use of the filibuster and its united front against Obama’s legislative agenda to blocking judicial nominees and its unprecedented (and repeated) threats to trigger a U.S. default, the most conservative Congress in over 100 years has stopped Washington dead in its tracks.

    http://www.perrspectives.com/blog/archives/002486.htm

  114. Yes Donna…..some people may not always express themselves well…….but don’t be sticking up for Delurker because she was very plain when she mentioned my health and my smarter half……as I’ve said before after 40 + years in a factory if a “f$ck you” is deserved that what I say…….(shop talk)

    If anyone really cares I’ll just say that I’ve found a young woman(52)……..she says its good for me to breathe faster and get my heart-rate up……..she wants me to start jogging also……..(HAHA)……Viagra…the best recreational drug made……(looking for cheaper source)($138.90/6)

    I think I’ve finally unclicked all the right boxes and haven’t seen M&H in my inbox in a couple of days……

  115. Delurkergurl, you are apologizing to someone who spoke to you like that? I get what is wrong with him, but what is wrong with you?

  116. Figures Don’t Lie: Democrats Do Lori Does

    Leave it to Ann Coulter to destroy Lori’s “myth” of Obama austerity. :lol: Better get you a new talking point Nag – this one ain’t flying more than 24 hours and by tomorrow, you’ll need to be burying it to hide the shame.

    http://townhall.com/columnists/anncoulter/2012/05/23/figures_dont_lie_democrats_do

  117. UAW, I am deeply sorry that I communicated so poorly that you got THAT out of what I said. Totally not what I said but that doesn’t change what you heard. I just meant I wasn’t going to get into the bait you’d flung, and often fling, and instead chose to focus on you as a person because I do care. I thought you knew that, and I’m sorry if I crossed some sort of line with my humor. Peace be with you, OK?

  118. UAW: people may not always express themselves well, but you are incorrect. The regulars here do care about you. It is a huge loss.

  119. UAW-
    did you get the emails to stop?

  120. Along with much of his past, when he called the Tea Party People Teabaggers, he most likely forgot that marching moment in Hyde Park.
    The hypocrisy is laughable.
    Does he remember anything?

  121. Why don’t you just use a baseball bat…..

    “UAW, I’ll ignore your recent posts just to ask, how are you doing these days? I’m sure it’s still hard being without your wife. Is your health OK? I’m never sure what to say to a person who has lost their smarter half. :D Despite being a resident curmudgeon & generally wrong sort of guy, people here care about you. :)”

    After that statement do you actually think that I believe that you care…..

    SMB

  122. so Obama’s a Tea-Partyer……..LMFAO……..

  123. Thank you Tex, I’ve been waiting for Donna & Lori to get B***h Slapped all week. Although I lack your style, I certainly appreciate it.

  124. Donna, Terri being low hanging fruit is right. Actually, I prefer the euphemism slow, fat rabbit but excellent legal perception there. At best Terri a garden variety Helen parrot and rube. The charges of misogyny were a dead giveaway, and she led with that. :grin: I’d light her up some more, but I’d much rather wink at you.

    But you’re wrong about us disagreeing on everything. I’ll bet we would agree on the sovereignty of Israel.

    ——–

    Tell me Lori. Have you ever heard the term bait and switch? The Nutting goon (appropriate name) uses 2009 as a Bush year. Bush was gone January 20, 2009. We had a complete Dimocratically controlled Congress the last two years of the Bush Presidency – you know, the entity that appropriates funds. You can’t be this stupid (well yeah, you could be considering you’re an upstanding member here).

    Let me ask you stooges intellectuals a few simple questions and you see if you can answer these for me. Put on your pointy tinfoil hats and square this for us laymen. Because, well America just isn’t buying your mendacity anymore.

    If federal outlay increasing exponentially under Obama is a myth, please do tell me where Obama got the funding for:

    A trillion when interest included in Obamastash stimulus?
    17,000,000 additions to the food stamp rolls, a 34% increase under Obama?
    Unemployment benefits extended to 99 weeks seven times, 73 week of that federal under Obama?
    Increases in the debt limit to nearly $16.4 trillion from $11.315 trillion when Obama was sworn into office in January 2009?
    The Debt rose $4.899 trillion during the two terms of the Bush presidency. It has now gone up $5.101 trillion since President Obama took office?
    Why did the United States experience its first historical debt downgrade in August 2011, a full 31 months into Obama’s hopefully first and last term?

    And these are just for starters, because I’ve only asked the most obvious. We won’t even discuss huge increases in budget for Dept. of Education, Dept. of Transportation, Dept. of Energy, etc…or Obama’s signature (cough cough) moment called Obamacare, or the multi-billion write down for the Iraq and Afghanistan War the CBO has allowed to fudge numbers from looking worse than they really are.

    So I ask you a simple question to our resident scholar. How could you possibly jive your statement of “fact” with the reality of approximately $16,000,000,000,000.00 in debt, going up approximately $4.1 billion per day???

    Why don’t you ask Mr. Nutting with his close M&H macroeconomists to break it down for us minions while I pop a little corn?

  125. Virtual manhood is better than no manhood, Terri. :D

  126. ya I read that article this morning lori, numbers very twisted and misleading.

  127. Spending binge never happened… imagine that!

    http://www.marketwatch.com/story/obama-spending-binge-never-happened-2012-05-22

  128. Thanks for the advice,although I can assure you I’m not upset. I disagree with your assessmen of his intelligence however. I think he’s a sad little man. Cheers.

  129. Terri: I might offer a few words about Tex, simply based on my past observations of him. I don’t agree with him at all on any issue that he’s raised here and imagine that I don’t agree with him on any issue that he hasn’t yet raised. Our views of the world are so different as to be irreconcilable. We have one thing in common as best as I can tell: I believe we both dislike and want to take on bullies. He has said he perceives me as bullying (moi?) and I perceive him as bullying.

    Although he can be beyond insulting and obnoxious, he actually is very smart. And apparently impervious to disagreement and especially criticism, at least from people on the internet. So, when you earnestly pointed out your disapproval of his comments, it was offering him low-hanging fruit. My bet is that your comment put a big, happy smile on his face and a “well, well, what have we here?” reaction. Probably best not to engage further–you’ll just end up getting upset.

  130. Weeelll doggie, looks like the rodeo’s back in town folks, complete with clown and bull. Yee-haw! Calf fries all around, y’all. :grin:

  131. Exclusive – The Vetting – Barack Obama, the First Tea Partier

    Hey! M&H Rubes? This one is for you. :grin:

    http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/05/23/Exclusive-The-Vetting-Barack-Obama-First-Tea-Partier

  132. The misogyny is palpable.

    Waaahhhh. If so, no more so than the misandry of the collective nags gathered here, of which you are obviously one. However, in my house there are nothing but women, me excluded. And they’ve never once played bruised little Suzy to deflect from the inanity of their arguments. You might as well call Uncle (or is that misogyny too?). Can’t you poor little women find something else to use as excuse besides your gender? zzzzz.

    Using words to describe people he doesn’t agree with like “groupies”, “bimbettes”, “eunuch”, “diseased herd” etc. Really? That’s your idea of being an independent thinker?

    You falsely assume I’m trying to be anything but spiteful. I don’t just disagree with your ilk, Terri; I loathe your lying ilk. So yes, I do enjoy it. Therefore, everyone of the adjectives was accurate, objective, and fitting – independent or superior had nothing to do with it. Are you going to hold the blog host and the multitude of man haters here to the same angelic standards, Terri? Or are you going to apply the typical leftist double standard in accusation and judgment ad nauseum?

    Your time on the internet might be better used looking up the name of a good shrink.

    :evil: No need for a shrink. That’s what progressives use when they’re not downing Zoloft and drinking Maalox by the bottle to soothe their many shortcomings. Just quit ducking so I don’t have to chase you around the ring. A well worn punching bag with greasy hair is all the shrink I need, and it would make my outlet easier if you would simply stand and be counted out.

  133. I’m pretty new to the comments section of the M&H blog, but as soon as I chimed in with an opinion that someone didn’t like, I found myself being disparaged in a really crude and over-the-top manner. But “Tex” takes it to another level. The misogyny is palpable. Using words to describe people he doesn’t agree with like “groupies”, “bimbettes”, “eunuch”, “diseased herd” etc. Really? That’s your idea of being an independent thinker? That’s your superior intellect at work? I have no idea why you visit this site except that you must enjoy anonymously hurling insults at people you don’t know. That’s pretty pathetic. Your time on the internet might be better used looking up the name of a good shrink.

  134. I believe you called it something like stirring up the monkeys. You give yourself too much credit in that regard.

    Good morning, Donna.

    I don’t think I stirred the monkeys. I know I stirred the monkeys. But that is neither here nor there, as my intent wasn’t to stir but to slap and give you and those like you a taste of your own bullying medicine. Like the Dylan song asks, “How does it feel?”

    I asked for confirmation from Pfesser on the previous post – I don’t consider most of these people simply rank propagandists and stupid. They’re something far more insidious than that. They fall somewhere between Kool Aid drinkers and petty groupies who move on cue to their Dear Leaders. Their claims are so bogus, the argument so weak, their minds are like children. And I could be wrong, but I don’t think the ploy is working anymore. I’m not here to debate their talking points – a complete waste of time and totally unoriginal. Frankly, most of these yahoos are helpless and have no aptitude for critical thinking. Pure instinct. They picked a team somewhere along the line, and they sit in the stands with their Big #1 Finger and their tub of stale popcorn, rooting for their team.

    But you’re being incredibly disingenuous or forgetful about your initial approach to my entrance. I have long memory and your intent was to gain argumentative advantage and inflict damage. The tone of Donna now is not the tone of Donna two years ago and the Donna of two years ago was of the vindictive sort. But I’m not complaining either. All is fair in love and war and I don’t hold that against you. Just reminding you that you’re not above the fray of dirty pool.

    If it makes you feel better (cough cough), I never considered you one of the monkeys. But neither am I as impressed with you as you would like me to be.

  135. Noah/Nagic: Under Michigan law, possession of any quantity of cocaine is a felony. Because of this, prosecutors frequently plead the cases down to attempted possession, which is a misdemeanor. As mentioned previously, state laws vary depending on quantity, circumstances, and priors. Enforcement also varies.

  136. We obviously disagree about drugs. I happen to believe that far more damage is done by alcohol, but someone with medical knowledge would be more competent to speak to that. Perhaps the Pfesser would.

    PFesser can back this up as will google. There are many benefits to consuming a glass of alcohol each and every day. If memory serves 1 glass of red wine is recommended. I think you will find a legitimate reason for people to take cocaine.

    As for alcohol being more of a problem. It is legal so more widely available. So in sheer numbers yes this is true. As for every other detrimental aspect, cocaine wins hands down.

    I dont know what the laws are where you are from but my brother is in Jackson prison in northern Michigan on a 2 year sentence for possession of cocaine and prescription drugs.

  137. Good morning, Tex. I think you and I view “outing” differently. I view it as trying to find out someone’s actual identity in order to cause them problems. I never did or would do that. I was sufficiently surprised by your rather unique entrance on to this blog that I was curious whether you did that sort of thing elsewhere. It would not have occurred to me that “Tex Taylor” was a real name, any more than “Bugs Bunny” would have been (or, for that matter, “Donna.”).

    I do disagree with your apparent view of the consternation you caused here–I believe you called it something like stirring up the monkeys. You give yourself too much credit in that regard.

    If, in fact, Mrs. Tex is fine with your comments, so be it.

  138. Pfesser,

    I have decided many of these folk aren’t simply stupid as I’ve commented in the past. They’re brainwashed. Consider the depravity of this comment:

    The deficit rose MOSTLY because of the diminished revenue and compounded interest rates, due to the depression he inherited from the Cheney err I mean Bush era. Doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure this out. It’s accounting 101. We have a huge country, the scary, scary numbers of the deficit aren’t Armageddon. We can overcome this challenge, reasonably.

    They aren’t just fundamentally, mathematically challenged as Obama just spent almost $4,000,000,000,000.00 last annual go around – outlay courtesy of the federal government. Over $10,000,000,000.00 a day. No, nobody could be that bad at math.

    Many of these people are ‘Dear Leader’ material. You can tell by the content of their posts.

  139. Good grief, Donna.

    What do you mean you haven’t tried to “out” anybody? Is that parody?

    You tried to “out” me here on this very blog with some of the other weaker glue horses and the eunuch PoolMAN™ipulator by “googling” Tex Taylor first time I showed up. :lol: I left a couple of comments slapping your collective butt cheeks and you went gaga, as the rest of the washed up herd bleated for you for help.

    Though apparently you’re making the attempt to change your patronizing attitude a little – a little too late.

    You don’t think my wife doesn’t know what I’ve said here? You do live a bubbled life, Donna. Personally, Mrs. Tex finds this whole concept of “blogging” a gigantic waste of time.

    Frankly, I found it pretty humorous that a verbal kick in the tail of a few cowardly, over-the-hill, sniveling bimbettes acting as collective bully to anybody that dared stray from the group think was met with screams of outrage. The consummate liberal fascists – dishing but unable to take it.

    When the rare bird like Rutherford, a liberal with a real brain and the credential to back it up is met with wailing and gnashing of teeth and the intent to destroy, the problem isn’t liberalism. It is the diseased herd you find yourself running, Donna. And the M&H liberal lackey male yes men who fan the haggardly? Shriveled and browbeaten. The absolute depths of depravity. Yeah, you Poolman. Have your testosterone levels checked sometime. You’re in short supply.

  140. They have checked it JJ.. and it’s certainly not difficult to check it oneself.. it is not true Obama is a big spending, expanding government, socialist, kind of President .. hell Bush added an entirely new layer to our Gov! (DHLS) —— not a word from the right about that.

    What Obama added was the 83 million stimulus ( that included tax cuts) after being faced with a crisis that was the largest econonomical crisis facing our nation since the great depression.

    The deficit rose MOSTLY because of the diminished revenue and compounded interest rates, due to the depression he inherited from the Cheney err I mean Bush era.

    Doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure this out. It’s accounting 101. We have a huge country, the scary, scary numbers of the deficit aren’t Armageddon. We can overcome this challenge, reasonably.

    Also too, many economists say the stimulus wasn’t enough! And they just might be right. Look at Europe, austerity hasn’t worked there, it won’t work here.

    Go figure.. maybe now.. people will listen????

    Obama/Biden 2012

  141. THE BIG LIE!! it is a blatant lie that President Obama has been a massive spender when compared to all the other Presidents. Here are the facts to prove it.

    After adjusting for inflation, spending under Obama is falling at a 1.4% annual pace — the first decline in real spending since the early 1970s, when Richard Nixon was retreating from the quagmire in Vietnam.

    In per-capita terms, real spending will drop by nearly 5% from $11,450 per person in 2009 to $10,900 in 2013 (measured in 2009 dollars).
    Yet you have every major GOPer from the Romneybot to McConnell to Boehner pounding the podium, wailing about “the prairie fire of spending” since Obama took office which our stenographic media dutifully reports verbatim without ever once mentioning it’s the freaking lie of the century. Hell, we’re lucky Politifact has never decided to check that one. After a diligent search, they’re bound to find a misplaced comma somewhere in the analysis and declare it mostly true.

    http://theimpolitic.blogspot.ca/2012/05/hey-big-spender.html

  142. Noah/Nagic: I’m not speculating about your family and I’m sorry you took my comment that way. It was lovely that you and your wife would have taken in a child who needed you. My stated surprise was only due to the way that you chose to present your life situation here.

    We obviously disagree about drugs. I happen to believe that far more damage is done by alcohol, but someone with medical knowledge would be more competent to speak to that. Perhaps the Pfesser would.

    I do hope that the contention of the President having engaged in felonious activity or been subject to a prison term has been put to rest. The law simply did not support that assertion.

    There are some interesting figures coming out refuting the current Republican talking points about federal spending. I hope to post them over the weekend.

  143. Pfesser: Both your comments are here. Again, as far as I know, there is no outing of anyone. This was an accusation by Noah/Nagic based on something that supposedly happened in the past. I don’t know the details. I do know that he is wrong in his claim that I was involved.

  144. The direct quote from Dreams of My Father is “pot had helped, and booze; maybe a little blow when you could afford it.” The President never quantified either, and certainly neither he nor anyone else suggested that he spent any amount of time in a “haze of cocaine use.” If people genuinely want to engage in a debate of issues, I think it’s important to make certain they are accurate in their factual assertions before making them.

    In a February 9, 2008 New York Times article, there is a detailed analysis of the supposed drug use based on interviews with people who were with the President at the time. It makes clear how unfounded the characterization offered on this blog is.

    Apparently the meme about how the President would have been a “felon” and “in prison” has been dropped. That leaves the notion that past substance abuse somehow disqualified a candidate for the Presidency, and that is why it is appropriate to respond with the information about Bush. If it was a disqualification for one, it was a disqualification for both. I happen to believe it was a disqualification for neither.

    And as for Noah/Nagic “setting higher standards for his children,” that is a surprising statement. I believe it was roughly a year ago that he shared the happy news that, after years of trying, he and his wife were expecting their first child. I remember that because it was that post that so startled the hosts that they specifically singled Noah/Nagic out in their next one. Perhaps there has been another child born immediately afterwards; if so, let me be the first to congratulate the Noahs. It is possible that when they are more than infants, he will be less rigid in his view of the issue of drugs.

    Pfesser: No outing. Noah/Nagic posted that people here had “outed” Rutherford and blamed several of us. I simply responded that whatever he was referencing, I had no part in it. I have no idea who Rutherford is and agree with you that internet outing is completely inappropriate absent extraordinary circumstances (e.g., physical threats).

  145. Apologies for the more-or-less duplicate post.

  146. I seem to have lost the last comment in the aether.

    It would appear that someone is getting outed by the NAGS. Don’t do it; it is the lowest form of Internet viciousness, and what goes ’round comes ’round.

    Since outing could conceivably represent a threat to one’s physical well-being, I think the first procedure for someone outed should be to contact the FBI and WordPress. It might result in some serious consequences for the “outers” and possibly the blog owner, including – if the person outed wanted to pursue legal options – revealing the real identities of those doing the outing. Maybe so, maybe not; I guess it would depend on how far the person outed wanted to press it. Me, I’d take it to the wall, however much it cost.

    Anyone here remember accidentally posting a link to a political form that, when you went there, had the poster’s real name, address and phone number? Remember that I emailed you immediately and told you to take it down? Think I have that information still?

    Folks on this blog sink pretty low sometimes; let’s try to at least stay above outing.

  147. Are we outing someone else?

    Of course, the first procedure for someone who has been outed should be to contact the local FBI office. Might not get you anything, but could possibly get a court order to reveal the identities of those threatening your safety by outing.

    Yes, Google is amazing. Anybody remember the time “someone” here posted a link to a political form and the link carried folks to the form, unfortunately already filled out with that person’s REAL name, address and phone number? Anybody remember who that was?

    Remember that I emailed you STAT and told you about it, so you could take it down? Think I kept that information?

    Nah, probably not.

    Outing is the lowest form of Internet viciousness. Don’t do it – what goes around, comes around.

  148. The behavior of the AZ AG really puzzled me inasmuch as his powers do have limitations. But then just about everything happening in AZ of late puzzles me.

  149. Anonymous what page is that on where Obama talks about spending his college years on a cocaine haze? I’d like to read what he actually said in context.

    If I had a graduating senior and the commencement speech was about saying no to drugs I would be furious. On a day when they are being recognized for their achievements so far it would be condescending to repeat just say no which they have been hearing since kindergarten. Commencement addresses are about challenging them to achieve their personal best. They are supposed to be inspiring.

  150. Wonder why we get barraged with bills that hurt the public and especially democrats? ALEC.

    Lobbying is an old tradition here in Washington D.C. It is expected that when your public service ends, you will be handsomely rewarded by offering advice and access to senators and other legislators. It is the way of the world.

    Yet, some people looked at this system and said “it’s good, but can we make it better?” It’s nice to be able to influence legislators when a new bill is crafted, or even to help create a bill, but the US is a big place. It’s going to take forever to wait around until a bill comes around that suits your interests. What if you could actually create bills to help you, and then roll out those bills proactively across the US?

    http://youarebeingmanipulated.com/model-lobbying/

  151. Mitt Romney, Republicans, The Bible and what does the Bible really say??
    Funny and you learn a lot. Dog Boy and Mr. Dan.

  152. Hi, UAW: I’m with Delurker. Hope you are ok. I had been proud of my garden until I read what you do.

  153. UAW, I’ll ignore your recent posts just to ask, how are you doing these days? I’m sure it’s still hard being without your wife. Is your health OK? I’m never sure what to say to a person who has lost their smarter half. :D Despite being a resident curmudgeon & generally wrong sort of guy, people here care about you. :)

  154. LMFAO….

  155. The Arizona Attorney General today says he will probably allow President Obama to be on the November Ballot. He even apologized for making AZ look stupid to the world. I think he should apologize to President Obama.
    Another Right Wing Fool having to say he was stupid and sorry.

    http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/05/ken_bennett_apologizes_obama_birther_hawaii_arizona.php

  156. damn NOP….

    “I wish our trolls had a more secure and loving childhood. Really makes you wonder what horrible thing happened to them, that they are so afraid now, that all they can do is get combative with strangers? Sad, really.”

    Really terrible that people like us learned to work when we were young instead of waiting for someone else to do it for us……..I’m retired and raising stuff in my garden(30000+ onions…1000+leeks), and doing the work that illegal aliens should be doing because people like you think they are to good to do it…..
    Well….Fu#k You…..

  157. WOW…..Bain Capital…..

    http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/05/top-obama-donor-tied-to-bain-layoffs/

  158. I recall allegations that George W was using cocaine while President. If it was ever substantiated I didn’t hear about it. With Cheney running the show I guess it wouldn’t matter if he did or not. :P

  159. Because I so value accuracy, I checked on former President Bush. He had a previous drunk driving conviction and has admitted his previous excess use of alcohol. He took his 16 year old brother out drinking (see 11/1/99 U.S. News and World Report), which would be illegal both in terms of DUI and providing alcohol to a minor. Further, when, in 1999, while campaigning for President, Bush was asked about marijuana and cocaine, he refused to answer, saying only that he had been “irresponsible.” He went on to say that the standard FBI questionnaire asked whether he had used illegal drugs within the previous 7 years and that he could truthfully answer “no” to that question. At the time, all other candidates answered the question, denying that they had used cocaine. Only Mr. Bush refused to answer.

    There are a number of reports in the media and two books that indicate cocaine use by former President Bush. However, I believe it is inappropriate to accept that sort of source as accurate–regardless of whom it concerns.

  160. whoops–would “not have disqualified” him.

  161. Noah/Nagic: Here I am at the end of the day, relaxing, and I see that you are again offering one of your opinions on legal matters. I am happy to respond.

    First, there is no proof or admission of “hard drug” use. The President has admitted that he smoked marijuana and that he tried “blow,” which is not the crack cocaine you regularly assert he used. So your factual premise is incorrect.

    Second, you have no information about the quantity of the drugs or, apparently about what constitutes a felony. Had you checked, you’d have learned that many states, even at the time in question, would have treated the incidents as possibly violations of municipal ordinances and more likely a misdemeanor, and not a felony. So your premises that, if charged and if successfully prosecuted, the President would have (a) been convicted of a felony and (b) gone to prison are both incorrect.

    Having corrected your factual and legal assertions, I can merely offer my own opinion on the question that you pose. I believe that the President showed a great deal of candor and integrity in admitting past recreational drug use. I also believe he showed determination and self-discipline in choosing to stop such use. I further believe that the issue relating to Romney is not simply that he apparently bullied another student and that he was intentionally cruel to a visually handicapped teacher, but that he laughed about those incidents when asked about them as an adult. So, one person offers regret about incidents that harmed nobody other than himself (the President) and the other finds humor in his past cruelty that did harm others (Romney). To answer your question, yes–I believe what Romney did was worse, both at the time and in his attitude towards what he did.

    I was not a fan of the previous President–far from it. But his previous alcohol abuse (whether or not that extended to driving while intoxicated–a criminal act in virtually all states) and what I believe to have been his previous cocaine experimentation would have disqualified him from holding the office.

  162. Concerned citizen, perhaps you are not aware that the paychecks of ALL those people will be impacted too. But taking EVERYONE ELSE down with them is collateral damage that the President says is unacceptable. That’s what he’s talking about.

  163. “Having read all the stuff on George Tierney, I cant see where he did anything wrong. Not sure what the fuss is all about.”

    Of course you dont.

  164. The George Tierney of Greenville South Carolina kerfuffle exploding on the Internet simply points out the low esteem wingnuts have of themselves and suggests that perhaps there is a God after all. No one could be more deserving of the spontaneous aftermath than George Tierney of Greenville South Carolina. His choice to publicly insult Sandra Fluke in the grossest possible terms was a grievous mistake that he will pay for forever.

  165. I agree Delurker that George Tierney of Greenville South Carolina is a docuhe and is getting everything he deserves.

    Cynthia.. LOL LOL that’s a good one about mrs George Tierney of Greenville South Carolina. I wonder if she knew what she was getting into when she married George Tierney of Greenville South Carolina?

    maybe I’ll use teh google and find out! ;-)

  166. Makes one wonder if a MRS. George Tierney of Greenville South Carolina ended his twittering around! Divorce soon to follow, eh?

    Peace.

  167. It appears that George Tierney of Greenville, South Carolina has closed his twitter account.

  168. OMG! That George Tierney of Greenville South Carolina is a fool and a loser!

    Some days I love teh Google. ;)

  169. “I don’t always know what I’m talking about, but I know I’m right.”

    Are you all referring to that George Tierney of Greenville South Carolina?

    Peace.

  170. It’s pity, not pitty.

  171. Massachusetts Senate candidate Elizabeth Warren says, “We need a cop on the beat so no one steals your purse on Main Street or your pension on Wall Street.”

  172. Donna, I agree with everything you say. It’s pretty amazing to listen to him accuse others of the very behavior he is guilty of. He is so unable to handle the opinions of people that he disagrees with that he sinks to crude, petty, and incomprehensible insults and rants. I will attempt to ignore him from now on. It’s kind of troubling to think of him sitting at his computer seething with hatred for the president and anyone who disagrees with him.

  173. ah…the troll’s last refuge: “but YOU deserved it.” In other words, let us assume that there is any merit in the troll’s accusations. His personal code of behavior is that this justifies him in coming here, lying, repeatedly and deliberately taking steps to get around the hosts’ “blocks” of him, hogging the blog and insulting people. People who are genuinely decent and honorable don’t lower themselves to what they perceive is the bad behavior of others.

    However, there isn’t merit. I have no idea what he’s talking about in terms of “outing” anyone and certainly did not participate in anything of the sort. I don’t know who Rutherford is, other than that he has a blog, I think he showed up here once, and he seemed smart. I believe I did indicate that Tex Taylor’s wife should know how he acted because I can’t imagine any decent person tolerating that level of pathology. But as far as taking steps in that regard–nope. Let him live with the knowledge that he is a miserable human being because he acts like when when he thinks he can get away with it.

    I have never disrespected the troll’s wife or children–merely indicated, based on his behavior that HE can’t be much of a husband or father. A condescending, rude, dishonest, and wildly immature person wouldn’t be much better in any other role than he is here.

    Personal attacks? True–in the sense that he displays colossal dishonesty and rudeness and acts like a bratty little child. People do call him on his own behavior, which has nothing to do with ideology. In fact, he uses ideology as his excuse to act like a jackass. If he had ever displayed a modicum of civility and respect, people (certainly I) would just ignore him or, if they chose, engage with him on other than a personal level.

    I stand by what I said: he is no different and no better than George Tierney of Geenville, South Carolina. If there is any worthwhile person in his–parent, wife, employer, sibling, friend–they would be disgusted to see who he truly is. Just as I am sure the people to whom George Tierny has presented a false front are disgusted to see who he truly is.

  174. Mitt Romney moved jobs overseas and destroyed businesses to make millions for himself. In this case 350 jobs – gone – because of BAIN and Mitt Romney.

  175. UAW-
    read to bottom of and find and follow the link in one of the emails to “manage my subscriptions” and delete the ones/all you want as far as posts which you don’t want emails from.

    and just for giggles and shivers, this is what we’re all watching here while we wait for a political redistricting plan to be finally accepted (hopefully in time for primary)

    http://www.alaskadispatch.com/section/alaska-militias

  176. Mitt Romney – The Job Destroyer

    http://www.addictinginfo.org/2012/05/20/jim-cramer-romney/

  177. I wish our trolls had a more secure and loving childhood. Really makes you wonder what horrible thing happened to them, that they are so afraid now, that all they can do is get combative with strangers? Sad, really.

  178. Mayor Booker speaks about the greatness of President Obama!!

  179. The Right Wing pissed off Corey Booker. I stand with Corey Booker but the Republicans sure don’t. George Tierny is all over the internets – funny to read about. http://juanitajean.com/2012/05/21/momma-do-not-click-this-link/

    http://leanforward.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/05/21/11799258-booker-to-maddow-im-very-upset-that-im-being-used-by-the-gop?lite

  180. George Tierny of Greenville, South Carolina. Finding the story and comments on dkos and firedoglake, along with the comments, is hilarious. Justice in action!!!

  181. Well, Terri: I certainly found the story about George Tierny of Greenville, South Carolina to be interesting. What a prince.

    The internet does many wonderful things. But there is a downside. Because people can conceal their identity, some of them feel free to do things that they would probably like to do in their day to day life but don’t because of fear of the consequences.

    Certainly, there are few of us who would barge into someone’s home, insult the hosts and their guests, and constantly dominate the conversation. Certainly, there are few of us who would repeatedly lie to people we know. And certainly there are few of us who, when asked to leave or actually shown the door, would repeatedly show back up at the door, giving a new name and trying to disguise who we are–so that the hosts are forced to again go through the effort of throwing us out.

    I think that most people behave on the internet as they do in their regular lives. They form relationships, they have exchanges that, for the most part, are constructive. Sadly, there are others who act like complete jackasses. They lie, they disrupt a blog, they say offensive and obnoxious things because they are entertained by the idea that they are upsetting others. They puff and preen, probably because they don’t get validation from other people. They aren’t people we would ever want to know and we should be grateful that we never will. They are a minor annoyance along the lines of the bratty child kicking the seat in front of him on an airplane.

    Some of them probably act this way all the time. Some of them are like the unfortunate Mr. Tierny, whose true character is now spread all over the internet. And some of them are like our troll. But either way, we can feel sorry for such unfortunate people and be grateful that they don’t occupy any more space in our lives.

  182. pasted from townhall.com

  183. Pf
    Do you have a point somewhere – other than the one at the top of your head?

  184. Anyone else notice some similarties between anonymous and George Tierny? Just saying’.

  185. just reading this weekends comments… yaeahhhhh it’s true Donna ROCKS!

    xo

  186. ROTFLMAOOOO NOP…. this HAS to be the best line..

    ” douchebags who like to shout stuff at ladies on the internet because, as we like to say: virtual manhood is better than no manhood at all.”

    Loveeeee it..,

  187. Other than being blinded by Obama’s reported brillance, this teacher does not have a command of the english language. Frightening that she is allowed to teach. The student sounds more knowledgeable than the teacher.

  188. Just because this is hilarious and because we’ve had language like this used against women on M&Hs. http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2012/05/20/internet-man-does-not-want-to-be-on-the-google-anymore/

  189. fanned that Patti. it is so much easier to see on a phone. ect.
    The trolls and their sock puppets are whinin cause they aren’t as visible on this type of format. LOL LOL

    #welcometo2012

  190. I know that some don’t like the new message format, but it sure has made life easier for me. My work computer doesn’t have enough ooomph to pull up such a long string of comments, so once it goes past 300 or so, I can’t see them as it times out before all can be retrieved. This format allows me to see all the comments – just 20 at a time. All I have to do to see them concurrently is to forward until I get to the point where I have read them, and then page back as I read through the new ones. I LOVE the new way!!!
    And, by the way, Donna has made the trolls look so bad, that they are seriously writing some ridiculous stuff just to stay on the string. I thought they couldn’t look any sillier, but they dooooo……

  191. UAW –

    “If you want to see all of the blogs you follow on the web in one easy place, sign up for a WordPress.com account.”

    I think this is where you need to go to delete from getting email updates.

  192. so why do I still have to delete M&H from my e-mail account….(the boxes are not checked)

  193. LOL LOL scorekeeper, he is a douche … and scared the commies are coming to take his job and his women… LOL LOL What do you expect?

    and on we gooooo…

  194. Pf – Geeze…what’s next…his birth certificate?. Are you PUI again!

    Peace.

  195. I’m pretty sure they are the BUSH/OBAMA Tax Cuts

  196. What is the purpose of sharing these? Do you have a point?

  197. God it’s the same right down to the red and blue colors….

  198. And another one:

  199. God, I never realized how much these posters match. Google up “communist posters.” Here’s another one:

  200. SUGGESTION: Ignore the TROLL
    He likes attention. JUST ACT LIKE HE IS NOT HERE.

    IGNORE THE TROLL.

  201. Good Night all.
    I feel sorry for the little fellow.
    I feel sorry for his wife and child actually

    President Obama has inherited a mess by GW Bush. The economy was in shambles and Bush took his money and ran. The Bush Legacy of debt and ruin will be with us for a long while. The biggest drivers of debt now and in the future are tne Bush Tax Cuts and the Two Wars which GW put on my kids and grandkids credit cards.

  202. Federal spending is lower now than it was when President Obama took office. I’ll pause to let you absorb the news.
    In January 2009, before President Obama had even taken the oath of office, annual spending was set to total 24.9 percent of gross domestic product. Total spending this year, fiscal year 2012, is expected to top out at 23.4 percent of GDP.
    Here’s another interesting fact. Taxes today are lower than they were on inauguration day 2009. Back in January 2009, the CBO projected that total federal tax revenue that year would amount to 16.5 percent of GDP. This year? 15.8 percent.
    One last nugget. The deficit this year is going to be lower than what it was on the day President Obama took office. Back then, the CBO said the 2009 deficit would be 8.3 percent of GDP. This year’s deficit is expected to come in at 7.6 percent.

    http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/05/15/484767/obama-budget-chart/

  203. Mitt Romney: The job Destroyer
    CNBC ANALYST: BAIN CAPITAL ‘FIRED A LOT OF PEOPLE’ TO GET ‘PROSPERITY FOR THE RICH’ | The private equity firm co-founded by presumptive GOP presidential nominee Mitt Romney “fired a lot of people” to get “prosperity for the rich,” CNBC analyst Jim Cramer said during an appearance on Meet The Press this morning. During a panel discussion on the effectiveness of an ad from President Obama’s campaign highlighting Romney’s past at Bain Capital, which bankrupted nearly a quarter of the companies in which it invested while making billions of dollars, Cramer said the firm’s past earned Romney a reputation as a “job destroyer, not a creator.” Watch it:

    http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/05/20/487367/cnbc-analyst-bain-capital-fired-a-lot-of-people-to-get-prosperity-for-the-rich/

  204. GW and Mittens talking about Bush going on the stump with Mittens.
    (Usually – They both go on stage and talk about how wonderful things were and are – why not now.)

    IDIOT: facts: IT TOOK 8 YEARS FOR GW BUSH AND HIS
    – TWO UNPAID WARS,
    -TAX CUTS FOR THE WEALTHIEST AND
    -DEREGULATION OF BANKS (Remember the bank melt downs) and DEREGULATION OF INDUSTRIES
    TO KILL THE ECONOMY!!! The meltdown was complete and GW Bush did the stimulus to the banks WITH NO RULES OR OVERSIGHT. It was a take the money and run situation.

    Here is a bit of the conversation between Mittens and GW regarding GW helping get Mittens elected. (Don’t Laugh- OK laugh. GW taking 8 years and screwing thing up then being asked to never say Romney is kind of funny.)

    Mitt: Well, thanks for the kind words, George, but would you mind never mentioning my name ever again. In fact, it would be great if we could just forget we ever knew each other. Do you think we could do that?

    George: You know, Mitt, I was the President of the United States for eight years.

    Mitt: I realize that, but you’d be amazed how most Republicans have very nearly forgotten all about that. It’s incredible really. We had an entire presidential nomination process and we were almost able to avoid any reference to you at all. If the Democrats would just play along, if would be like your presidency never happened. You’ll admit that might be for the best.

    George: If you think so. But I sure would like to go to the Republican convention. Maybe I could say a few words.

    Mitt: We’ll let you know.

    http://the-reaction.blogspot.com/2012/05/george-w-bush-incredible-shrinking.html

  205. Hey Idiot:

    First: Why are you always crying to Pi? I am being picked on what is that about? Quit acting like a first grader.

    MATH; TWO UNPAID FOR WARS AND THE GW BUSH TAX CUTS RAN UP THE DEFICIT!!! The spending by President Obama is a small part of the total mess. That is the true math.

    HERBERT HOOVER: AUSTERITY BUDGETING created the GREAT DEPRESSION and the resulting HOOVERVILLES! FDR, a rich dude, said we need to stimulate the economy and get people to work. IT WORKED!!

    EUROPE: AUSTERITY BUDGETS: They have gone the Austerity Route and the economies are tanking. Those that stimulated the economy instead of going Austerity are making good economic progress.

    So: You are full of crap. Now, go run to AlaskaPi and say somebody said you were stupid because you have proven yourself to be stupid.

  206. Jo..all the tax increases in the world wont matter if we get another 4 years of Obama and his out of control spending, as the Eat the Rick video proved beyond all doubt. Math dont lie

  207. I find it comical really that GW Bush said, “I support Mitt Romney” as an elevator door was closing.

    I think it is also comical that Mitt has asked GW not to get involved in his campaign. Mittens does not want people to remember the disaster which GW Bush and Cheney left for our hero, President Obama.

    the troll sure is a pretty sorry llittle fella.

    The hike was great. I saw fresh bear poop, a Mountain Goat was 20 feet away from me and I was on the collapsing Glacier. It was pretty awesome.

  208. actually that was an intentional K Donna but thanks for helping me prove to Pi again.

  209. Why the economy is slowly recovering the responsibility of the wealthy among us in making our nation great and financially successful. Great stuff

  210. Pf
    The best you can do is dredge up an old Red Chinese poster from the fifties and try to compare it to Fairey’s poster of Obama. That is pretty pathetic. I see no resemblance whatsoever and your lame attempt to twist the Red poster into an association with Obama is so lame, it’s laughable.

  211. The wealthiest need to help their communities and their country by paying a fair share of taxes!!! It is the American thing to do. I paid 30% in taxes and so can the rich guys.

    I believe the most important thing we, as Americans, should be doing to counter this is to stop envying it. Every time I see a Fortune 500 list or read about who makes the most profits in Las Vegas I get sad. If the article is coupled with how much that individual contributes to his community, then my sadness is replaced with a belief that the millionaire in question is wise enough to understand that his gifts come with responsibility.

    Corporations won’t stop finding ways to profit with no ethical responsibility until we place our respect in those wealthy individuals who understand that leadership (wealth) comes with the responsibility of caring for the communities from which they profit.

    http://m.lvsun.com/news/2012/may/20/riches-comes-responsibility/

  212. It’s spelled “scum,” Noah/Nagic. Ooohhhh….ahhhhh…..

  213. The real truth about the economy.

  214. THE TRUTH ABOUT THE ECONOMY in Two Minutes. Quite well done. or – What happened to the middle class? The economy has doubled since 1980 but the middle class is being left behind. How did it happen?? The answer is here.

  215. By: Donna on May 20, 2012
    at 7:41 PM

    This is the perfect example of the BEST Liberals have to offer. Can you imagine anywhere else a person would make these kind of observations about an internet stranger? These are the kind of people we have to deal with. True skum of humanity we have here. Were I king for a day :)

    Told ya so Pi.

  216. Your source, please?

  217. Discussions about Romney, Zimmerman, Obama and life mean little when it comes to elections. Here is Obama’s Economy:

    Federal Spending 25% of GDP-highest since WW II
    Budget Deficit 10% of GDP- highest since WW II
    Federal Debt 67% of GDP – highest since WW II
    58.1% of population working – lowest since 1983
    Long term unemployment 45.9% – highest since 1930’s
    Home ownership rate 59.7% – lowest since 1965
    Taxpayers paying income tax 47% – lowest in modern history
    Gov dependency 47% – persons receiving 1 or more federal dollars
    Debt downgrade – First in American history

    Standard & Poor’s, US Bureau of Stats, Office of Management & budget, US census,

    You can post all day, but Obama will not be reelected for the above reasons.
    You can be right all day, just don’t believe this election isn’t about the Economy!

  218. Terri: the physical response that Noah/Nagic/Anonymous attributes to us doubtless is one that Mrs. Noah/Nagic has never experienced and never will. Or, to be more accurate, not with him. She’s probably grateful that he spends his time trying to get a response out of strangers on blogs rather than unsuccessfully attempting to get a response out of her.

  219. Naa Delurk…it is just me proving myself right about you Libs to Pi yet again. The party of personal attacks. Its all about attacking the person not the ideology. It always has been, always will be. Its all you guys got. Thanks again for being you.

    Terry, thanks for helping as well. (kisses)

  220. Anon, you really are a pathetic little jerk!

  221. “What is REALLY cool about Donna and Terry, is that they actually take time to talk about spelling. Everything that is going on, and spelling it turns out is what gets them all wet.”

    Sounds like a Republican concession speech to me. Out-facted at every turn, the only alternative is to flail like a fish on the dock. Gosh, it’s fun to watch!

  222. What is REALLY cool about Donna and Terry, is that they actually take time to talk about spelling. Everything that is going on, and spelling it turns out is what gets them all wet.

  223. Anon. please give us your link that shows JJ is lying. I am sure you are not making a baseless accusation.

  224. Dear Helen, okay, maybe you shouldn’t run for president, but I think the Democrats need someone like you for a spokesperson. You and Margaret should have your own column in the New York Times. It is HEALING to read the words that should be headlines–why does no one else seem to get this? Thank you, thank you, thank you!

  225. Anonymous, my name is spelled with an i, not y. Constantly making the same mistake seems indicative of your reading comprehension and memory.

  226. lori – do you realize how much that poster of Obama you are using for your avatar resembles all the communist posters of the ‘forties and fifties? Here’s a good example.

    What is most disturbing is that his lemmings aren’t even bothered by the resemblance. (((LOL LOL LOL)))

  227. JueauJoe –
    Great video on creationism. I had the same discussion with one of my professors when I was in engineering school. A big creationist and leader of the campus Jesus people, he said that self-assembled complexity was impossible. Because he was a PhD, and the vice-chair of Mech Engineering, he carried a lot of weight, and his student minions sat there, dumbly nodding their heads.

    So I simply asked him, “So that means thunderstorms are impossible, right? They represent complex organization that operates the same way each and every time – so that is impossible?”

    Didn’t make any friends that day. LOL. I have a degree in biology, a doctorate in medicine and have been a pilot for thirty years – meteorology, and especially thunderstorm avoidance – is something I deal with every day, so I had the background and information to refute his weak responses. Lots of fun.

    Another prof of mine told me a very long time ago, and it stuck: this kind of thing thrives on ignorance, and as we know, ignorance is on the increase.

  228. Its a good thing she has you to speak for her Terry, because I am sure she is not capable of taking care of herself. Not to distract from Obama campaigning when he should be doing the people’s business yes?

  229. Hey anonymous, Donna has wasted enough time on this weekend.

  230. Romney = big money donors

    Obama = grassroots.

    I was not aware that campaigning more than the last 5 Presidents combined = grassroots campaigning. Maybe we would be in better shape if he was doing the people’s business rather than lining his own pockets.

  231. Here is my source. Yes, it is from the 08 election as we don’t have figures for the 2012 election. It is 6 months away.
    Since this election has not happened, how would you compare this election?

    Goldman contributions to Obama were 4 times more than McCain.

    articles.cnn.com/…/obama.goldman.donations_1_obama-campaign-…

    Obama raised almost $16 million from employees in the securities and investment industry and their families for the 2008 election, according to the Center for Responsive Politics.

    2012 could very well go for Romney as they put their money on winners, not losers.

  232. Noah/Anon: Why did you lose the discussion???? THE FACTS ARE AGAINST YOU!!!!! It is the same problem which the Republicans in general face. The Right Wing Crazies will have lots of money to put out lies and distortions on the airwaves and on the radio through the election. We all know it is going to be ugly.

    the problem for the Republicans is that they are telling lies and distorting or leaving out critical pieces of information.

    NOAH: YOU GOT YOR ASS KICKED and deserved it. It was not even close really. Sound bites and red herrings do not win arguments – facts do. THE FACTS ARE NOT ON YOUR SIDE.

    Here is a blog entry about the discussion of Romney and Bush talking about Bush endorsing Romney. BTW: Romney is pushing hard to make the Bush policies (on steroids) the Romney economic policy during a Romney Presidency.
    Enjoy your day, I am hiking out to a glacier.

    http://the-reaction.blogspot.com/2012/05/george-w-bush-incredible-shrinking.html

  233. Donna, You’re my hero. You deserve your Sunday off. Job well done. It
    ‘s been so satisfying watching you destroy the trolls. thanks.

  234. Noah/Anon: You are really looking like the fool at this point. Donna and Lori are kicking your butt – BIG TIME.

    My suggestion for you would be to put your tail between your legs, walk off, turn on the TV and watch FOX. Forget about M&H for a few days because you have been embarrassed for your stupidity. Try checkers or putting a 500 picture puzzle of Rush together.

    If you stick around, I pity you and your thought processes.

  235. Noah: You are so fond of saying “I’m not here to do your research.” I gave you the cite–check it yourself. And Corzine (please try to at least spell his name correctly or is that too difficult while you copy other people’s work?) is widely recognized as being the target of a criminal investigation. You see–this probably is over your head (a low bar indeed) but what happens is that the government actually obtains all sorts of records and documents and interviews witnesses and does all sorts of other things. Then, when it believes it can prove its case beyond a reasonable doubt, it files criminal charges. Perhaps you can go check out a basic text on criminal law.

    Campaign contributions are a matter of public record. The low information and deliberately deceptive (Noah/Nagic/Anonymous) can certainly seize on one that shows a snapshot in time and cite to it without analysis. However, the most conservative analysts and commentators widely recognize (check out their writings in lieu of Fox, Noah/Nagic/Anonymous) that the investment banking and banking and financial communities are and will support Romney over the President.

    So, friends and troll, let us return to the history of this weekend. It begins with the troll making a completely uninformed and false statement about the President supposedly “sealing” his records. He clings like a barnacle to that and is apparently overjoyed when his pal Backgammon cites to an SEC (why the SEC?) regulation for support for the proposition. When confronted with the actual FOIA statute and case law that utterly refutes his proposition, he immediately launches into his attack du jour: about the supposed link between campaign contributions and no criminal prosecution. When confronted with the inaccuracy of his factual assertions (which totally destroy the logical link he tries to make), he is untroubled that he has lied again. His figures are wrong, there have been criminal prosecutions, and there are current criminal investigations and civil cases that can recover (which means restitution, troll) millions if not billions of dollars.

    What have we learned from this exercise? Nothing we didn’t already know: when it comes to Noah/Nagic/Anonymous, the stupid truly burns. And he is completely lacking in any interest in or respect for the truth. But let us be vigilant for an increase in this sort of stunt during this important election year, both from the deliberately dishonest (Fox, Rove, etc.) and the low information and irrational (our troll). I’m off to enjoy my Sunday.

  236. Yep that’s true Donna.. In fact Obama’s take from small donors in the month of March was somewhere around 53 million. April was down slightly to 43 million. That still amounts to 53 percent of his total contributions thus far.

    A small donor is considered $200.00 or less. The Obama campaign recently ran a fundraising event that required just $3.00 from its participants. The event was an overwhelming success raising 15 million dollars.

    On the other hand Romney’s small donor contribution was something like 13 percent of his total take for April and March. With a whopping amount of 57 percent coming from $2,500.00 + donors.

    In recent days the Romney campaign has tried to walk that back with some very fuzzy math… Buttttt it doesn’t take a CPA to figure it out.

    Romney = big money donors

    Obama = grassroots.

    Fired up and ready to go…

  237. “President Obama and any money he gets is small compared to the Right Wing Pac”

    (waits to see if Donna has the integrity to debunk Jo’s “lies” with the same vigor)

  238. With Citizens United and the Right Wing Billionaires putting money into the Rove and friends Right Wing Attack Groups, President Obama and any money he gets is small compared to the Right Wing Pacs. The Right Wing Pacs are outpacing the Dems by at least 4 to 1 or so. I have read as much as 10 to 1 in favor of the Koch, Right Wing Pacs. The Billionaires are making money by having their taxes lowered with buying up right wing poliiticians. Obama can get all the money he wants but it is peanuts compared to the Right Wing Billionaires and the money in the Right Wing Super Pacs.

    Here is a video about Creationism and Evolution. Quite Interesting.

  239. Interesting words from Noam Chomsky Sorry if someone already posted, Cant make heads or tails of this new blog layout.

    http://townhall.com/video/noam-chomsky-palin-was-right-about-obama

  240. List for us the real numbers Donna. Did he take $48.999 mil and not the 49 claimed? You sure were vague with the facts, as you always are.

  241. Donna
    Can you provide us a link that shows the charges Corizine has been brought up on? Since you seem to know everything I am sure you are up to speed on these charges.

  242. WTG Donna!!! kickinnnnnn some ass girl! ;-)

    JJ… fan.. like … love your Bernie link… spot on..

    Have a lovely day all … xoxox all

  243. Game on. Backgammon quotes (without attribution) an article from October 2011. According to the February 2, 2012 Christian Science Monitor, when figures were totalled for 2011, Romney had received more from Wall Street than did the President. This was taken directly from Federal Election Commission filings.

    Romney’s six largest campaign contributions were executives, their families, and PACs for Goldman Sachs and its counterparts. They gave Romney $1.8 million.

    The President only had Goldman among his top 20 contributors and his “take” was $64,000, compared with $496,000 for Romney.

    Backgammon has (without attribution) quoted an article from almost 8 months ago, before Romney was the presumptive nominee. He has not provided the more current or complete data, including for 2011.

  244. Donna is kicking butt again!!!! Great Job!!
    Anonymous: Take a nap and then watch FOX maybe Scarah Palin will be on.

    Bernie Sanders says: Congress does not regulate the banks, THE BANKS REGULATE CONGRESS. 3 of the 4 largest banks are bigger than when they were during the BUSH ECONOMIC MELTDOWN! Bernie says it is past time for Congress to do something.

  245. Obama Tops GOP Candidates in Wall Street Donations

    New figures show President Obama continues to pull in huge donations from the financial sector, with more money from Wall Street this year than all other Republican presidential candidates combined. According to the Washington Post, Obama has raised a total of $15.6 million from banks and other financial firms, with nearly $12 million of that going to the Democratic National Committee. Republican frontrunner Mitt Romney has raised less than half that much from Wall Street, around $7.5 million. A top banking executive and Obama fundraiser told the Washington Post that reports of Wall Street antagonism toward Obama “are exaggerated and overblown … [but] it probably helps from a political perspective if he’s not seen as a Wall Street guy.”

  246. The score now stands at –

    Donna – 116
    D&Der – 0

    Once again…..the crowd roars!

  247. largely because you’re lying again. I made the decision to correct your factual misstatements and ignore your efforts to taunt or otherwise provoke people. The former demonstrates how stupid the latter is.

    Everyone, let’s debunk Noah/Nagic/Anonymous’s latest falsehood. This one took exactly 30 seconds. May 16, 2012 entry on factcheck.org both provides the true facts about the contributions (including debunking the $49 million figure) and gives specifics about the criminal prosecutions of those who actually violated criminal laws, regardless of their contributions to the President.

    The debunking includes providing proof that contributions to Romney thus far greatly exceed those to the President from those that are the subject of the recent comment.

    Please further note that this was not some original “insight” from the resident troll. Instead, he simply parroted (surprised?) an ad from a 501(c)(4) that calls itself “American Future Fund.”

    Yet another of what the kids call “epic fails.” I realize that Noah/Nagic/Anonymous has no interest in offering truthful statements but you’d think that even he/she/it would by now be a little embarassed at the extent and frequency of his lies.

    And Noah/Nagic/Anonymous: drag your lazy ass to factcheck for the proof. No need to link to it here because, with the exception of yourself and your occasional backgammon partner, I trust that pretty much every other visitor is aware that you are a liar.

  248. No worries guys, whats a few million broken eggs, or in this case families, as long as a few of Obama’s buddies came out on top. I am also noting neither one of you had anything to say at all about Obama raising $49 mil from this guys. We know you dont get that kind of money for nothing.

    Mitt bullies someone in his youth, and we get dozens of pages of comments. Obama takes more money than any candidate in history, from a bunch of criminals and not a word.

  249. Delurker: a civil forfeiture case can be brought against either an entity or the individuals responsible. Statutes frequently are phrases in terms of “causing” something to occur. Sometimes they define potentially responsible parties as including specified individuals.

  250. Donna, in those civil cases like the ongoing ones the SEC has against Goldman, who pays the settlements & fines? Is it the company or the individual? I can’t help but wish that people who have ruined so many lives would be ruined themselves. Seems to never work out that way, though.

  251. Delurker: You make excellent points. In addition, the government frequently wants to pursue civil cases rather than criminal ones. First, there is the lower burden of proof–it is not required to prove a case beyond a reasonable doubt. Second, if a particular witness refuses to testify on grounds of the fifth amendment in a civil case, the government is entitled to an adverse inference that the witness’ testimony would be an admission of criminal wrongdoing. That’s exactly the opposite from a criminal case, in which the government may not put a witness on the stand that the government knows will take the fifth. Further, in a criminal case, if a witness does decide during trial to take the fifth, the government is not entitled to an inference or to comment to the jury about the invocation. Finally, in a civil case, the government does not need a unanimous jury–it does in a criminal case. There are many reasons why a particular administration would pursue civil prosecutions rather than criminal ones, and it absolutely does not mean that wrongful activity is tolerated.

  252. “Not one person has been charged” is false. There have been a few.

    http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2011/oct/07/michael-moore/no-ceos-have-been-arrested-bringing-down-economy-s/

    The issue is that in order to charge someone there has to be a specific law broken. What should they be charged with? Felony recklessness? Is Obama supposed to retrospectively write legislation that makes it easier to arrest these guys?

    The investigations aren’t over, and of course I hope more people will be held accountable. It’s more likely we can get results from civil cases against them.

    Welcome to the OWS movement, Anonymous. We could use your support in Elizabeth Warren’s fight for financial reform!

  253. changed should read charged

  254. It has been 4 years since the financial collapse, and not one person has been changed. Why? Could it be that Obama has raised more than $49 million from Wall Street? More than any other candidate in history? His chief of staff made millions on Wall Street. Corizine has lost 1.6 billion of customers money but hasnt been changed. Corizine has raised more than $500,000 for Obama Seems to me Obama is looking out for his Wall Street Donors.

  255. “You sincerely need to seek medical attention” Really Backgammon, that’s all you have in response to Donna’s take down. You’re even weaker than nagic.

    Keep in mind that when Donna fights, she fights like a girl; this means that you’re gonna have to be fighting your best game plus 1 times 10 (otherwise only multiplying your best game by 10 would still be 0).

  256. Meanwhile Donna has been playing an awesome game of chess.

  257. Donna kicked butt!!!

    This is for Donna. I think our friend should try checkers.

  258. You sincerely need to seek medical attention.

  259. Good job, Donna!
    In a “nation of laws” it really makes sense to talk about what the laws actually are.
    And learn more about law, intent, regulations, and the like.

    Helen and Margaret –
    thanks for having us all in!
    I do mean all -since this would not have popped in so fully or explicitly without part of the all who show up.

  260. The score now stands at –

    Donna – 62
    D&Der – 0

    The crowd roars wildly!

  261. Donna, You rock! It won’t stop the haters but I’m enjoying every minute. You go girl.

  262. Donna, You are Great!!!

  263. you are most welcome, Poolman. And it was an argument that I would make against disclosure in the event that the records were within FOIA and there was no FERPA. There’s just no need to make it.

  264. Thanks, Donna for pointing me straight. I get in a stomping mode and overstep my territory sometimes. Carry on. :wink:

  265. And since I am having such a good time here, I’ll provide you one more cite. Please see DOJ v. Tax Analysts, 492 U.S. 136 (1989). This Supreme Court decision explains the circumstances in which an agency may be deemed to have control over a record, even if it did not actually create it. So, to be completely, scrupulously accurate, an agency can OBTAIN a record in the course of its normal duties that the agency itself did not create (this is the case with certain law enforcement records). However, that record would still be subject to exception 3, which would be based in turn on FERPA. Happy reading, gentlemen.

  266. Poolman: You are incorrect, my friend. While, on its face, educational records would seem to fall within Exception 6, they do not because they were not created by the agency in the first instance.

    As for the troll, no–Backgammon did not “score.” Instead, Backgammon looked at a regulation that implements a statute and failed to look at the statute itself. First year of law school teaches the difference.

  267. Backgammon: You have made my day! Although you provided a link to the SEC regulations on FOIA, you missed a crucial step in the analysis, which is what records are within the scope of FOIA in the first place. Unless a record is within the scope of the statute, one never reaches the issue of whether that record is nonetheless subject to an exemption. To put it simply, you have muddled the provisions of two distinct laws: a statute and a regulation implementing that statute.

    I would direct your attention to 5 U.S.C. sec. 552. That is the FOIA statute. It, in turn, requires virtually all federal agencies to enact regulations implementing the statute. I’m not sure why you selected the SEC’s regulations; however, they are virtually identical to other agencies’ regulations. It’s appropriate to use them as an example.

    In order to be obtainable under FOIA, a record must qualify as an “agency record.” [For purposes of FOIA, the executive branch is treated as an agency.] Further, to constitute an agency record and, therefore, be within the scope of the statute, a record must be one that was created by that agency and that, at the time of the request, is within that agency’s possession and control.

    The President’s educational records were not created by any federal agency. Nor are they within any federal agency’s possession/control. Further, FOIA, like any statute, must be harmonized with other statutes on the same subject and more specific statutes control over more general ones. Please see 5 U.S.C. 552(b)(3), which codifies this principle into FOIA. In this regard, I would direct your attention to the Federal Education Records and Privacy Act (FERPA), which prohibits the dissemination of records about a student subject to very narrow exceptions. FOIA requests are not such exceptions. See, for example, Krauss v. Nassau Community College, 469 N.Y.S.2d 553 (1983).

    Educational records of a government employee would not be created by an agency, so are not subject to FOIA at all. Records relating to the health of an employee of an agency would, to some extent, be in the agency’s possession because of health-related claims and issues. They are, as you note, subject to a specific exemption: 5 U.S.C. 552(b)(6). Your error is in assuming that, because educational records are not subject to a listed exemption, they are subject to FOIA, unlike medical records. However, that misses the fundamental point that educational records are not within FOIA at all.

    You also make the same mistake as the resident troll: claiming that the President “sealed” his educational records. It appears that your opinion in that regard is based on your further belief that someone has made an open records request for the records and that request has been declined. Almost certainly, the response to such a request would make the same points that I am making in this comment: (a) the educational records are not agency records and, therefore, not subject to FOIA in the first place and (b) in any event, could not be disclosed under FERPA. Any competent lawyer would confirm this analysis.

    As previously mentioned, this is an area in which I regularly practice. I do have confidence in the response that I gave you, which is that educational records are not subject to FOIA requests. Indeed, they are not within the scope of FOIA at all because they were not created by a federal agency. I understand that there are some lawyers who post at Rutherford’s blog and I am willing to bet that they agree with this analysis.

    Finally, I would note that neither the restrictions nor the implementing regulations were created by or during the Obama administration. These are issues that go back decades. FERPA was enacted in 1974.

  268. I’m not a lawyer, but it seems that school records fall under exemption 6 ( personal records) in your link, Backgammon. It also seems a little googling confirms this. I could be wrong, but I doubt it this time.

    Maybe you should stick to board games.

  269. Backgammon fades back..he shoots…he SCORES!!!

  270. Donna, I realize you THINK you know everything. Educational records are NOT included in the exemptions. Medical yes. So you will know even more in the future, I have done your homework and provided the list of exemptions which does NOT include a request for educational records of a Senator, President. There is a reason Obama has SEALED those records. Since the answer isn’t in your scope of knowledge, you really should not spout so confidently.

    http://www.sec.gov/foia/nfoia.htm

  271. I can just see liar…err lawyer Donna in court with the judge. Judge…my client is innocent. Just trust me I know what I am talking about, proof would only get in the way. My word is good enough……

  272. zero documentation = I’ve been right about Obama all along. Thanks for backing me up Donna.

  273. Austerity is crashing the economies of Europe and people are being voted out of office to change that policy. In the US Boehner is talking about more AUSTERITY MEASURES to help cripple our economy.. Check out this video on Austerity and how it works. Well done.

  274. for those who have no use for
    facts and such

    “you got to lie to me baby and move on…”
    :-)

  275. Donna-
    Thank you.
    This is just more silliness along the order of the he’s-never-been-but-a-community-organizer foolishness.Good, bad , or indifferent, Mr Obama’s open history of participating in Illinois Legislature vis a vis vote records, news stories, daily records of proceedings and so on were adamantly ignored and his teaching at the law school was under scrutiny as “bogus” by some who choose not to understand what a professer is- even in the face of what the University itself defines as a professer.

    http://www.law.uchicago.edu/media

    Yes, enough lying leads to lying “truths” getting lodged in peoples’ minds and false equivalancies should be called out .
    It works because some “stick to the side streets you’ll never get caught ”

    or pretend they don’t get caught :-)

  276. By the way, Backgammon: FOIA requests (and their state equivalents) have been the subject of lots of litigation in terms of the documents covered and the timing/basis for disclosure of those that are. Sometimes decisions are difficult to fathom: for example, in Alaska, Todd Palin who was not an employee of the state but was cc’d on a large quantity of emails on his wife’s private email account that she used to try to avoid FOIA disclosure was treated as an “advisor” and many documents on which he was cc’d were withheld based on the executive privilege. Interesting area of the law and I’m sure you are not simply focused on President Obama’s administration. In fact, the positions taken by his predecessor were far less consistent with disclosure.

  277. Thank you Obama Administration and especially Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, you are the best. http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/chen-guangcheng-leaves-beijing-hospital-headed-for-us/2012/05/19/gIQApKMEaU_story.html

  278. Backgammon: I deal with FOIA all of the time. I’m not sure what records you are referring to that have been the subject of a request. If you are speaking about college or medical records, those aren’t subject to FOIA. If you are referring to something else, please advise. Not sure what your statements about the budget have to do with the topic, but you are certainly entitled to your opinion.

    Nice try, Noah/Nagic/Anonymous, but contining to lie doesn’t make your statements truthful. The President did not “seal” anything and your continued insistence that he did proves nothing more than that someone who has repeatedly demonstrated that he has no credibility will continue to lie aftrer he’s been busted. You are as credible as the laughingstock Orly Taitz.

    I believe that any thinking person appreciates the difference between sealing a record that is otherwise publicly available and taking no action with respect to a record that, by law is private. But then, our troll, is not a thinking person but is instead a mindless parrot.

    Now, it is remarkable that the troll who constantly says “do your own research” is insisting that I provide him with a link so that he can do what any decent human being would have done before posting: make sure his statement is accurate. But Noah/Nagic/Anonymous, try snopes or factcheck. Both nonpartisan. Both provide substantiation. Both will give you citations to the applicable statutes. It will take you less effort than it probably does to continue to try to get around the blog’s blocks of your posts. You must be so proud to continue to haunt a place where the hosts have indicated you aren’t wanted and the majority of the commenters appear to agree with me that you have earned the “nothing but empty time on [your] hands” to which you admitted in a rare moment of candor. On the other hand, you do serve as a reminder of how low a low information voter can be.

  279. Except Donna didn’t and couldn’t set the record straight. There has been a Freedom of Information act request by Judicial Watch for 4 years. No answer, no reply, no records. Still have to ask why?

    Obama can show how his budget was voted down 97/0 in 2011.

    Obama can show how his budget in 2012 was voted down 414/0 in Congress.

    Obama can show how his budget in 2012 was voted down 99/0 in the Senate.

    Not ONE Democrat would vote for Obama’s horrendous budget in the Congress or the Senate.

    Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0512/76461.html#ixzz1vKS5g3RJ

  280. Donna..what part of OBAMA SEALED THEM DIDNT YOU UNDERSTAND? HE ACTIVELY SEALED THEM. The rest you might want to check the needle on your record player, it seems to be skipping and repeating the same hollow arguments. Stop making excuses.

    “If one takes the roughly five minutes necessary to fact check, one will learn that the President did not write a formal thesis in college for the simple reason that none was required.”
    Link proving it, because we all you would never misrepresent the truth…again.

    What I really think is cool about Obama is his ability to relax even though out nation is in terrible condition. 17 vacations in 3 years. This IS a man of the people, he gets us…he lives like us…right?

  281. Good work, Donna. Thanks for taking the time to set the record straight.

  282. Dear Matt, My 2 cents worth. I preferred the old style of commenting. I used to jot down the last commenter, date and time so when I came back to the site, I could go right on reading. from oldest to newest. This new format has me going up and down and page to page finding, etc.

    Love what you are doing for dear Helen and Margaret. Keep up the good work.

  283. Fact checking doesn’t take a great deal of time. However, someone who would rather simply spread falsehoods will simply type up fabrications and exaggerations and hit “post comment.”

    Bush’s grades were hacked–he did not authorize their release. Once they were out in the public, he acknowledged and then posted them on his campaign website during the 2004 campaign.

    The answer, if one truly believes that grades are significant, is to lobby for a change in the law. It is not to continue to mindlessly spew slurs based on half-truths, inaccuracies, and outright lies. But then that is all that the resident troll has. Perhaps the best example of this is his feigned outrage over the college thesis (“Sealed a thesis paper? Really?”). If one takes the roughly five minutes necessary to fact check, one will learn that the President did not write a formal thesis in college for the simple reason that none was required. A thesis is required for certain graduate degrees (not typically undergraduate). Most people with any familiarity with higher education are aware of this.

    There are colleges that do require undergraduate theses. Some of those do make them public. Some do not. Again, most thinking people would check to see if the colleges attended by the President even required undergraduate theses before claiming that the President’s thesis was not publicly available, much less suggesting that the reason for its unavailability was some affirmative act.

    The President did write a paper on foreign policy for an honors class and that would not be private. However, neither Columbia nor the professor retained a copy (another thing about which Noah/Nagic/Anonymous is woefully ignorant is records retention.) The professor remembers the paper and has discussed it publicly, even though he does not have a copy of it. If anyone has a genuine interest in learning about the subject and substance, they can readily do so.

  284. A Republican refused to sign the Grover Norquist “No Raising Taxes on the Weathy’ pledge. He says he is putting country needs above the Grover Pledge. Is this possible??? Can a Republican put US Economic needs over the ideology of Grover Norquist and the Republican talking points? Fortenberry must not be up for re-election this November.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/ezra-klein/post/jeff-fortenberry-one-house-republican-whos-dared-to-defy-grover-norquist/2012/05/17/gIQA5Q0wVU_blog.html?hpid=z11

  285. 1. Occidental College records: SEALED !!!
    2. Columbia College records” SEALED !!!
    3. Columbia Thesis paper: SEALED !!!
    4. Harvard College records: SEALED !!!

    Had to recopy this from above. Sealed a thesis paper? Really? Bush released his grades…so what are we REALLY trying to hide here?

  286. UAW: you are operating under a false premise. Both liberal and conservative candidates and office holders have the same legal status for educational and health records. That allows both to release what they want and not release what they’d prefer not be public. Certain customary disclosures are made and they do not include educational records or all medical records. They do include a number of years of tax returns.

    Again, look at McCain. He absolutely refused to release his educational records. And look at Romney. He refused during the primary to release anything but his last year of tax returns. In both cases, it would have been negative: for McCain, because his peers have said his grades were so abysmal; for Romney, because of his complicated tax shelters and sending money out of the country. The public doesn’t know the details because both candidates would not disclose them. And they had the legal right not to do that. It truly is no different with liberal candidates.

    You said again last night that you could find out about Romney’s “high school years.” But again, I believe all we know is where he went (ditto the President), and about some of his activities (ditto the President). I am pretty sure that his transcripts weren’t released but if you have them, please identify the source. Otherwise, what the public does know was not released by Romney but by his classmates. Nothing nefarious there.

  287. yeah, what Donna said! Go get em girl! LOL LOL

  288. The real job creators are the middle class. Sadly, they are shrinking fast.

  289. What I find interesting is that Donna thinks that doing crack and other drugs, hanging with known communists, socialists and terrorists is far less of an offense than being an alleged school bully.

  290. Oh gawd, if the stupid didn’t bless us with an appearance once in awhile things would be so boring here. I will be laughing most of this night. LOL

  291. yes Donna….
    freely admitted and apologized for….
    and Helen complains about Mitt for apologizing for it if it happened…….
    seems like a double standard here again…..
    lets forgive the liberal and crucify the conservative…….
    WTF…..

  292. Yes Donna ….has MSM “not ” checked into anything about liberals….
    my point being that even if they tried they’d be stymied at it…

    kinda like Trever Martin is starting to look likr the Duke Lacross thing…..

    why is it OK if Obama does something and not OK if Mitt does it??????

  293. Donna, you seriously need to check into valium or prozak. Chill Girl!

  294. What about Romney’s high school years do you know, UAW? Do you have transcripts? Evaluations? Physical records? The fact is that Romney’s high school records are subject to the same privacy as the President’s high school records. I don’t believe that Romney’s transcripts or grades are public–if I am incorrect, please let me know.

    What IS public about Romney’s high school years are the complaints about him bullying a fellow student and a sight-impaired teacher. Those incidents are corroborated by witnesses. There do not appear to be the same reports about the President, although he, himself, has candidly admitted to things about which he isn’t very proud.

  295. OK Helen…..lets talk about high school years……..Romney’s you can find….Obama’s are sealed……WTF……..If he was a conservative he’d be accused of all sorts of things…….OH that’s right…he is……

    so is Obama guilty of something he might not have done???????or something he has done???????even MSM doesn’t know……of course MSM won’t look……

  296. UAW: Not sure of your point. Yes, you can make accusations about anyone–but why would you if there’s no proof of them? That’s different from the things the President freely admitted in his book–and has made clear that he regrets. He was open about those things and I view that candor as admirable.

    And I’m not sure of your question about how it feels to be treated like a conservative. Certainly, I don’t jump to believe rumors or stories that are put on the internet without substantiation. And I’ve asked people here not to do that. It’s wrong regardless of who it’s about.

    If there’s anything that I find abhorrent about the internet, it’s the propensity of people to spread stories as though they were fact. As much as I loathe Glen Beck, I disliked when people were doing it about him. As much as I think Sarah Palin is distasteful, I don’t want people to do it about her. So your point is?

  297. and JJ….
    ‘Just a month earlier, Obama had held a 10-to-1 cash advantage over Romney.”

    http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/story/2012-05-18/Obama-campaign-cash-beats-Romney/55068318/1

  298. Donna…I’m going to take you up on that…….
    “What the President did not do is UN-seal private records and disclose them. ”
    OK……..I truly believe that he got a 1.7 in college…..prove me wrong….
    I truly believe he pushed a black woman down…(in his book)…prove me wrong
    I truly believe he was a drunk/coke addict…(in his book)…prove me wrong
    I believe he molested a 4 year old white girl…….(go through his records and prove me wrong)……..(can’t do that)…..
    Publicist says he was born in Kenya….??????
    how does it feel being treated like a conservative???????

  299. On the assumption that it’s a genuine question, UAW, I don’t think anyone views Bush as a terrible president because he formerly indulged in drugs and alcohol. So the disapproval of Bush has nothing to do with those things. But I bet you already knew that.

  300. UAW: Do you find Romney’s high school experience of more relevance than his tax returns as an adult?

  301. just kinda wondering why it’s OK to have a former beer drinker/coke sniffer in office and the last drinker/coke sniffer was so terrible……

  302. just kinda wondering why we don’t have the same info on Obama’s high school years as we have on Mitt’s…..

  303. I prefer to read the comments in chronological order. Anyway to give the option? Thanks.

  304. Slightly OT question. – looking for an answer. When and why did the Republicans flip the stars on their logo? Thanks.

    Peace.

  305. Delurker, I’m rolling on the floor LMAO, because I am certain she wouldn’t be the only one. Romney should have seen this coming and opened up and spoke about his religion and its influence on him, Kennedy had to and so Obama. It shouldn’t be that way, but….

  306. NOP, yes… MIL feels Mormonism is a cult. She’s torn between the cult-guy and the black guy. What to do? Well, if WHP is presented I suspect she’ll stick with the guy who has been President for 4 years and hasn’t ended the world after all. Hope so.

  307. How did that Jim Carey movie go. Lawyer—-Liar—(shrugs shoulders) I am sure you gave it your best. Compose yourself and try again later.

    I do take some small comfort should things go south thanks to Liberal policies, Shakespeare’s solution to lawyers might just get implemented.

  308. This, WHP stuff, really would hit the evangelical crowd like a ton of bricks, though.

  309. Beck actually believes in the WHP, he is a Mormon in case you didn’t know.

  310. Lori “Lying, which is basically what he does, is despicable. And there’s the chance that someone might accept his fabrications as truthful.”

    Sooooo much more likely ANYWHERE but here. His purpose isn’t to educate or save one confused soul. His purpose is to annoy. Don’t let him. :D

  311. Donna, those words were too big to be effective, though you were perfectly correct all the way.

  312. Oh, Terri: There’s not a shred of a chance of getting through to Noah/Nagic/Anonymous. He comes here, gets banned, adopts a new name and horses around with his computer to hide who he is, comes here, gets banned, blah blah. The Walter Mitty of the internet. Classic troll.

    So why respond? I rarely do. But I will when he makes false factual assertions because those genuinely should be slapped down. Different opinions about actual facts are a wonderful things. Lying, which is basically what he does, is despicable. And there’s the chance that someone might accept his fabrications as truthful. So, while I ignore virtually anything he says (why bother to do otherwise?) I will correct falsehoods.

    This whole “disclosure” issue is such nonsense. The best example is John McCain: he was acknowledged by his peers to be at the absolute bottom of his class and absolutely refused to release his academic records. Complaints from those such as our troll? Nary a peep.

  313. Oops looks like Pi took my badge! Lol its ok I wasn’t using it tonight’s

  314. Lol lol delurker great idea!!!!

  315. Seems as if happy hour started early in MI tonight.

    NOP, I must admit the first thing I thought when I read about WHP was that I could use it with the easily-swayed-by-Beck older Christian people in my life to pull them back to the center. :P

  316. Donna,
    Awesome response. unfortunately I think it is wasted on anonymous. I’ve come to the conclusion that some people are just not reachable. Good try though.

  317. Noah: It’s difficult to believe you are not being intentionally obtuse. But let me try again. The President did not choose to seal anything. The records are sealed. And they are sealed by virtue of laws passed during both Democratic and Republican administrations. I know the laws, you clearly do not or you would not continue to make such an elementary error. And, like a badly behaved child, you simply get more and more strident insisting that the President sealed anything at all. He didn’t. A grade schooler could confirm that with the most basic research.

    What the President did not do is UN-seal private records and disclose them. And my question of you was rhetorical: I already know what Reagan and the Bushes and other presidents have and have not disclosed. It is you, with your puerile claims, who don’t know whether any other political figures have disclosed precisely what you claim the President should have disclosed. Thus, you are again displaying your remarkable ignorance: contending that the President is hiding things without a clue as to whether he is doing precisely what every other office holder has kept private.

    You then try your nonsensical “but there is a demand!” line. So bloody what? The fact that buffoons like yourself clamor for something doesn’t mean you have either the right to it or any legitimate claim to it. And the fact that charlatans like Jerome Corsi and Orly Taitz gin you fools up by readily disprovable assertions just shows how mindless those who make these sorts of claims are.

    In addition to ignoring that the President is behaving in accordance with customary practice (as established by Presidents of both parties) you studiously disregard that Romney is acting contrary to it. He refuses, despite requests (from people far more intelligent than yourself), to disclose his tax returns. Those go directly to his claimed qualification for office–that he is such an astute businessperson. They also go directly to his claimed platform–that he will reform the tax code. Yet, unlike other Presidents (and, in fact, his own father), Romney refuses to disclose them.

  318. Delurker, it was in connection with the Wright debacle yesterday that I first heard of the WHP. So yes, in retaliation, I’m sure it would be used by some Super Pac, it is out there and a lot of people know about. I don’t give it a lot of credence, because I’m not into prophecy, but we all know that a certain segment of the American population can be really freaked out and they are already concerned about Romney’s religion. This is going to be one humdinger of an election. I plan, not to miss one minute of the Republican Convention. I want to see what the Paul people have up their sleeve. And nobody, I have nothing to discuss with you, find someone who gives a damn what you think.

  319. It’s not a question of if it’s when the PACS will do it .

    If they are smart they will hold off until after the convention to roll out the WHP.

  320. I wonder why certain posters have never mentioned their urgent desire to see Mitt Romney’s birth certificate,college transcripts, and tax returns?

    Terry, for there to be an urgent desire to see them, there would first have to be an urgent need. Have you seen people urgently asking for these things and Romney sealing the requested items then waiting years to show them?

    No One’s Puppet
    I did as you asked now let us have this conversation about ideologies you were looking to have.

  321. Donna
    I am not here to do your work for you. If you have a need to know something about Ronald Reagan’s, by all means please look it up yourself. I am not here to serve you.

    I am sorry I am not explaining myself in such a way as to allow you to understand the conversation. I am not talking about the things he chose to keep seamed. I Am talking about the thing Obama CHOOSE to seal in the first place.

    As for the records of the other Presidents, I am not aware those items were requested and denied. Do you have anything that shows these people went out of their way to seal the records then denied any and all requests to unseal them?

    As for your claims of disagreement with Obama, I find that hard to believe. You never post them. Sorry but your “claims” ring hollow. Perhaps you might spend your time with my pal honesty. He can bring a lot of happiness into your life if you give him half a chance.

  322. Wowwwww, NOP. I hadn’t heard of the White Horse Prophecy! Had to look that one up.

    It would be seriously hypocritical to go after the Wright connection and then cry foul over a WHP connection. In other words, it’s inevitable. Popcorn?

  323. lori-
    ROFL until I almost wet my pants and break 2 ribs!
    Alrighty- then , got a badge !
    Helen and Margaret-
    thank you for having us all in :-)

  324. Donna, you’re right, of course these issues never come up when one of theirs is running. Can you say hypocrisy?

  325. LOL LOL No problem Pi you can borrow mine >>>>>>>

  326. Terri: It’s because they are determined to seize on something–anything–and they lack critical thinking. Certainly, if they had for years claimed that Presidents should disclose all of their college transcripts or if they had clamoured for birth certificates, they might have a bit more credibility.

  327. It is already out there, I honestly think it could go more mainstream from the Ron Paul people or from a liberal super fund.

  328. I wonder why certain posters have never mentioned their urgent desire to see Mitt Romney’s birth certificate,college transcripts, and tax returns?

  329. NOP: How do you think it’ll come up?

  330. You can just google “white horse prophesy” for yourself. I think it is bound to come up during the campaign, I’m not saying that is a good thing, but it is likely to be followed up on by some outside group.

  331. It doesn’t make me uncomfortable at all. You see, I know the law relating to public records. And I know the law relating to educational and health care records. And again, your repeated statements that he “CHOOSE (sic) to keep certain things sealed” is based in ignorance. I would appreciate you informing the group here of the comparable records that, say, Ronald Reagan disclosed. Were all of his health care and educational records obtained by him and made public? How about either of the Bushes? All you do is continue to blither about sealed records, when you have no concept of either the applicable law or the relative public disclosures by others. And, again, the fact that you cling with dogged insistence to falsehoods says a great deal about you but certainly doesn’t make your misstatements any more accurate.

    And, predictably, you then pivot to your accusation that I (as you have claimed about others) are unwilling to disagree with or criticize the President. Of course, his policies tend to be more in line with mine. However, I very much disagree with certain of them. So it’s just another meaningless gibber from the resident low information troll. Perhaps you might spend your time and energy looking for a bright, informed, educated conservative and ask him/her to post here. I know I’d welcome the debate and I’m sure others would do likewise.

  332. Same could be said of you Donna. I have a hard time finding you to be the end all be all authority of Obama and his failure to disclose. He CHOOSE to be President and have a public life. He CHOOSE to keep certain things sealed for years. Those are the facts. Now you may not like that. and It certainly seems to make you uncomfortable.

    Bottom line is you play at being honest but you have no idea how to practice it. No President is perfect. But if we were to read the propaganda you and others put forth, one would think the man a god. Your inability to criticize anything he has done tells me you are not to be trusted. End of story.

  333. Ah…again with the “but he sealed his records” line. The poster (and we all know who it is) cannot identify a single record that the President has sealed and continues to misuse that term. To the contrary, the records of which he claims to be so concerned are, as a matter of law, not available to the public. Nor are they ones that are customarily disclosed by candidates for office. This is in contrast to Romney’s tax returns for the bulk of the period when he was either running for or holding office.

    Repeating a lie doesn’t make it true.

  334. I have not No One’s Puppet, enlighten me, and yes I do.

  335. I am sure your justifications help you sleep well at night Terry, end results are the same.

    Problem I have with anti-birther folks is they never had an issue with Obama taking years to produce proof. They didn’t care about Obama sealing things that were unnecessary to seal unless there was something to hide. And finally I certainly have a problem with the standard you hold for those of opposing political views that you do not hold yourself or your side to.

  336. Hey Anonymous,
    There’s a difference between facts and opinions and between facts and lies. Asserting President Obama was not born in the US is not an opinion, it’s a downright lie and it’s not a fact. Read all the NewsMax, Blaze, Breitbart and WND you want–just don’t call it facts. They will happily print all the crap (or as you call it, “opinons”) you are interested in reading. Knock yourself out.

  337. is ok , lori :-)
    but I’m making myself a G2S badge to wear anyway

    the battles for my grandkids’ futures are the reason for my chosen path too- but most of the issues are Alaska centric so my way suits me and what I see needs to be done here to allow them as grown women and men to take up their lives with dignity and parity at the table.

  338. Neither the Blaze nor Breitbart are “news outlets.” They both are easily discredited sites that promote exaggerations and outright falsehoods. The marketplace of ideas does not benefit from fabrications and political discourse does not benefit from those who offer lies rather than opinions based on actual facts.

  339. Well anonymous, have you heard of the “white horse prophecy?” Do you really want to discuss ideologies?

  340. Could we please make this site a “birther free zone”? That racist crap is beneath contempt and not worthy of being on Margartet and Helen’s site. And let’s not use Breitbart or The Blaze as references. It would be a lot better to use reputable sources of information, not propaganda sites. JMO.

    Really is a shame so many people willingly want to help promote a Communist style world. Who needs varying opinions? That only encourages free thinking. Something to be avoided? Lets outlaw any news source that does not follow the party line. Because there is only one side to a story? One point of view? One set of values? Those told to us by our government?

    Just astounding.

  341. PF: I would hope T. Martin got a few good licks in before he was killed by Zimmerman

    So maybe there was a report I missed. They know now that Zimmerman was the aggressor and hunted down Travon?

  342. Marlene, your scenario makes perfect sense to me, if I am ever stalked in the dark by a man with a gun, I will fight with everything I’ve got at my disposal. I would call it self-defense, but if Florida wants to call it standing your ground, so what. Someone following me with a gun, as I peacefully return home is up to no good, would be the first thought that runs through my mind.

  343. LOL LOL PI… didn’t mean to imply YOU were a G2S, I know better.. I’m jussss sayin I sure as hell am not going to be.. I am giving every single penney I can to any pac I can, and will continue to do so UNTIL we have public elections… Two parallel thoughts.

    There is toooo much at stake—— my daughter’s future is at stake. Sorry…. love ya to death, but we are not on the same page with this one.

  344. lori-
    I needed the laugh!
    No one has ever called me a goodie 2 shoes in my life! Love it!
    Sitting in a state with a crappy Senator who got in there via a super PAC formed by so called Alaskans Standing Together ( which included a $100 K donation from my Native Regional Corp without shareholder approval- diff kind of corp than most know about) I’m content to stay a G2S for now :-)
    Add J Miller and all the bucks the Tea Party Express dumped here and NONE of our real issues for a Senator to work on us for got into the dialogue running up to the election. Just a load of he-said-she-said crap and we lost.
    Yup- G2S Pi !

  345. Well Pi.. I respectfully disagree… like it or not… Pacs are real and they are here to stay up and until a few of the SCJ die.

    Sooooooo I’m not about to sit back and be the goodie two shoes standing on principle while women’s rights are stripped away, citizens are denied the right to vote, or the American Taliban rides rough shot over me.

    Yes, I will fight like hell for public funded elections, but until and when that becomes a reality you bet your sweet a**** im gonna fight fire with fire.

  346. super PACs are terrible- no matter who/what they are supporting- esp the ones supporting things/candidates I support.
    is total BS to play the fight-fire-with-fire thing which seems to be the new order of the day.
    c’mon voters- send the flyers back, turn off your radios and tv when the ads/infomercials come on and contact those stations and tell em you don’t like those ads.
    this crap is effective in swaying votes if we let it be so. we need to stop letting it be.

  347. UAW… do you think super pacs are ok? just curious…

  348. yes JJ……super pacs are terrible….OH WAIT…..

    “with top fundraisers like Rep. Nancy Pelosi and Sens. Harry Reid and Chuck Schumer making rounds of pleading phone calls to major donors, and congressional Democrats including Sen. Al Franken attending events for the new outside groups”.

    Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1011/66758.html#ixzz1vEnV8dH7

  349. yes JJ…super-pacs are terrible……OH WAIT….

    “with top fundraisers like Rep. Nancy Pelosi and Sens. Harry Reid and Chuck Schumer making rounds of pleading phone calls to major donors, and congressional Democrats including Sen. Al Franken attending events for the new outside groups.”

    Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1011/66758.html#ixzz1vEnV8dH7
    …..

  350. I cannot make heads or tails of this blog anymore. Rest of the civilized world reads top to bottom. IF the goal was to cut down conversations then this was a good way to do that.

  351. PF: I would hope T. Martin got a few good licks in before he was killed by Zimmerman. Reverse the situation…you are walking to your “home” or where you are visiting, you are not as familiar with the neighborhood, it is night and raining, you are unarmed. Someone you do not know is following you, you run, he runs, you hide, he looks for you. You want to go home, you don’t know what to do. The stranger appears before you and you think you are discovered — you think I’ll push him and then when I can run as fast as I can. The stranger goes down, but you are scared he will get up, you strike out at him to hit him so you can get up and run. You hope you are dealing with someone who wants to rob you and not someone with a gun but you only have one chance…you hit out at him…and he hits at you but then without warning, without saying “get off of me or I’ll shoot” he fires his gun and you are dead.

    The minute Zimmerman left his car he became a stalker. The 911 operator told him to stop, he didn’t. IF he had waited by his car the police would have been there – Martin would have come out in relief and both would go on their way. The minute Zimmerman stalked the “stand your ground” rule switched to Martin — he was the one in danger, he was the one chased – but he was only armed with his hands and he used them to defend himself.

  352. Just to prove my point that certain sites are unreliable:

    http://www.mediaite.com/online/vetting-the-bed-breitbart-coms-kenya-born-obama-o-bombshell-blows-up/

  353. PF, I have no idea why it is so important to you to profess Mr. Zimmerman’s innocence, oh wait a minute, I get it. In the meantime, back to politics, this is a rather interesting article, http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/ct-met-ricketts-emanuel-0518-20120518,0,3285917.story

  354. Could we please make this site a “birther free zone”? That racist crap is beneath contempt and not worthy of being on Margartet and Helen’s site. And let’s not use Breitbart or The Blaze as references. It would be a lot better to use reputable sources of information, not propaganda sites. JMO.

  355. Judicial Acitivist Right Wing Supreme Court Justices have made Corporations people. ‘Corporations and the wealthy now have super pacs which they can use to sway votes this taking away power from the average person. This is quite interesting: Shedon Whitehouse

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2009/07/13/743443/-The-Real-Story-Of-Day-One-John-Roberts-Judicial-Activism-

  356. Evidence continues to pour in on the George Zimmerman case:

    http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2012/0518/Latest-evidence-in-Trayvon-Martin-case-Does-it-help-George-Zimmerman

    Still want to maintain your initial opinion of Martin’s “fighting for his life”, NOP? While sitting astride George Zimmerman, pummeling him with “MMA” – Mixed Martial Arts – type blows? That must be a new kind of self-defense I never learned about in my years of Isshin-Ryu training.

  357. Well Lori, it not as if we haven’t figured out how to read PF’s secret code now is it?

  358. Yep JJ , or they have the luxury escape to Singapore to escape capital gains on their American born company’s IPO windfall. Sick!

  359. Food or Medicine: That is the choice faced by many. The wealthy get car elevators and wars aplenty.

  360. Hmmm….I never took any of that birther stuff seriously, but it appears that Obama’s OWN PUBLISHER, before BO had any aspirations of being president, identifies him as having been born in Kenya.

    Now I see that he says it was a “mistake.” (((LOL LOL LOL)))

    This, combined with quite a few missing records, including airline flights during that time, have to give one pause.

    Of course it’s like the brouhaha over Nixon’s pardon; playing this out on the public stage is more damaging to the nation than just saying, “He’s the pres, and that’s all there is to it,” and moving on. I recommend that course of action.

    On another front, NOP opined:
    ” I’ll wait for the trial, and I’m sure it will be on Court TV, before I decide how their encounter actually happened and if I think Zimmerman is guilty or not guilty.”

    I’m with you. Who knows what happened for real? The Brits have a strong set of laws forbidding disclosure of the particulars of a case before it is tried. I sometimes wonder if that would be a good thing here, too. Certainly all the public gnashing of teeth and the exploits of those two racial ambulance-chasers, Jesse Jackson and his sidekick Sharpton, would be blunted, and perhaps Zimmerman wouldn’t have to be in hiding until his trial. Not a very American way of doing business, is it? I’m sure you remember from your grade school that thing about “innocent until proven guilty,” right?

  361. Thanks for clearing that up anon. Now, could you please point out the exact post or posts that Lori or “her side” made that was/were vicious concerning this matter. Remember that if you lower the bar too much on what constitutes vicious, I will think that you are overstating your case (polite form). I’m pretty sure you won’t be devastated though.

  362. farsight Δ
    Sorry it wasnt spelled out to you. One side, lori’s side, claims all the other side has is vicious personal attacks. Yet look at you all.

  363. Sent the last post before intended. Probably made as much sense as anon.

  364. Anonymous @ May 17, 2012 at 10:12 PM almost makes less sense than the relentless birther crap. Birth certificate proof has been provided (though never to the satisfaction of the hopelessly delusioned). Z trial hasn’t happened yet. False equivalency

  365. Remember, don’t take the snarks, slams and personal attacks personally… It’s just the way they roll. They have nothing else.

    Great–another fool spreading birther crap. How special.

    guess that describes both sides

  366. Obamas Reportedly Planned to Divorce

    While they appear to have the perfect marriage today, Michelle Obama once prepared to divorce Barack, a stunning biography claims.

    What he did against her objections

    More News on Huffington Post

  367. Great–another fool spreading birther crap. How special.

  368. Proof Obama Born In Kenya? Obama Literary Agent Says Yes

    By Floyd Brown61 Comments

    Breitbart.com has introduced some explosive evidence showing that Obama claimed he was born in Kenya years before he became a presidential candidate. Interestingly, the editors of Breitbart still think that now Obama is telling the truth. … [Read More...]

  369. ahhh anon, NOP, and I are good friends she knows Im jussss funnin her. it’s all good ..

  370. One side of mouth
    Remember, don’t take the snarks, slams and personal attacks personally… It’s just the way they roll. They have nothing else.

    Other side of mouth
    Hell, he went to school in THIS country! HE knows we aren’t to have an opinion on stories before we have all facts.. geeeeze……

    #asshat

    That is all.

  371. ROTFLMAOOOOO NOP.. I am SURE Pf doesnt have an opinion on the Zimmer case one way or the other. YOU must be mistaken.

    I know this because.. step back now, I’m going to cuss…

    Hell, he went to school in THIS country! HE knows we aren’t to have an opinion on stories before we have all facts.. geeeeze……

    #asshat

  372. PF, I’ll wait for the trial, and I’m sure it will be on Court TV, before I decide how their encounter actually happened and if I think Zimmerman is guilty or not guilty.

  373. Who can’t wait for G.W. Bush’s new book, “Strategies for Economic Growth” comes out? I can’t believe it’s anything other than a work of fiction. You would think this is an Onion story but apparently not. I guess it’s true what they say about truth being stranger than fiction. Sheesh…

  374. LOL LOL UAW, I hadn’t noticed.. I’ll pay more attention. ;-)

  375. hey Lori….before you get to sanctimonious….go back and read some past posts…….the libs here can also dish out the slams snarks and personal attacks…….

  376. Donna –

    My mentor from residency and I have kept in touch; the one thing we have had in common from ‘way back then is that we are both big-time supporters of Israel.

    He sent me this video:

    http://www.stepupforisrael.com/

    I think you have to put in a email address to get it to play, but it is worth the bother. It is inspiring to say the least. Thought you might appreciate it.

  377. anyone else anxiously waiting for Facebook’s IPO price to come out???

  378. Thank you for my daily chuckle, ladies. Well-written and the points you made are spot-on. LOVE!

    ~Carrie

  379. NOP queried –

    “PF, are you saying Trayvon Martin did not have right to fight like hell to save his life? A jury might disagree.”

    I didn’t say anything like that at all, and you know it.

    I said what I said: basically that as more evidence comes in, it looks like things went down exactly as Zimmerman said they did. A little one-sided, maybe, since the other fellow isn’t saying much, but the evidence speaks for itself. How is it, res ipsa loquitur?

    Of course, getting to your question, anybody has the right to defend himself, even if he is not – like George Zimmerman is not – a member of a protected pet group.

    ***********

    On another front: since the brouhaha over Obama’s Web people’s alteration of the former Presidents’ biographies on the White House site to include campaign rhetoric (God, have you people no shame?), there have been a number of parodies. Here is one of my faves.

    http://obamainhistory.tumblr.com/

  380. Newt Gingrich once said (in anbout 1995 or 1996) that the problem with the GOP was that they didn’t encourage their people to be nasty. I’d say they have certainly gotten over that!

  381. It’s pretty sad that elections in the US end up being mud slinging contests. The Republicans seem to be the nastiest; going back to when they were calling Bill Clinton a murderer, drug dealer, rapist, etc. With this president we’ve had to listen to all the birther nonsense; as well as all the socialist BS. It’s really discouraging. The right doesn’t seem to think any Dem has a right to hold office, they are constantly challenging the legitimacy of so many Democrats. This is my personal opinion from my own observations; not trying to start an argument

  382. Buckle up M&H followers! It’s going to be a bumpy ride..

    A look at what is to come.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/17/us/politics/gop-super-pac-weighs-hard-line-attack-on-obama.html?_r=2&hp&ncid=webmail1

    You think the trolls on this sight have been nasty recently??? Multiply that to the 10th power.

    Remember, don’t take the snarks, slams and personal attacks personally… It’s just the way they roll. They have nothing else.

    They are nasty old white men that are looking at their better days in the rear view mirror…

    FORWARD!

    namaste …

  383. PF, are you saying Trayvon Martin did not have right to fight like hell to save his life? A jury might disagree.

  384. My personal preferences don’t matter – I just appreciate the site and the fact Matthew is the one maintaining it so let’s just say do what is easiest/best for you and I’ll deal with it. I enjoy your Grandmother’s postings and as always thank you for the work you do to share it with everyone.

  385. Matthew, LOVE the new format!!!!!

  386. So 2 wrongs make for justice? Cant say I agree. Sounds like something an eye for an eye Bible thumper would say.

  387. An uncivilized law may just result in an uncivilized reaction!

    Peace.

  388. “But then, if that is true, what caused Martin to fear Zimmerman?”

    Who said he did? By Z’s account, he had circled around and attacked him from behind. True? Who knows…

    “One brought a bag of Skittles and Ice Tea to the fight”

    Irrelevant. If Z’s account is correct – and there is plenty of corroborating evidence that it is EXACTLY correct – his Skittles are as irrelevant as the brand of underwear he was wearing. That little moiety is just used to paint Martin as benign; Zimmerman’s wounds say otherwise.

    “and the other brought a loaded gun/weapon”

    Yep, but Martin didn’t know that.

    “In the past there would not have been a gun or the “right” to use it. It would have been a shouting match or a fist fight.”

    You think you can’t beat someone to death by pounding his head on the pavement? Come to my ER sometime and I’ll show you differently. If it went down like Zimmerman said, and someone had YOU down on the ground, slamming your head against the pavement, and you had a gun, you’d shoot him, and so would I.

    No question much of this situation was Zimmerman’s fault, but stupidity or poor judgement is not the issue. The issue is, was what happened covered by the Stand Your Ground law or not? From all appearances so far, it would seem it is. We’ll see what the jury says. I am far more interested to see if folks are willing to accept an innocent verdict without burning down the town.

    *****************

    Our resident Milton Friedman hisself opined: “when you cut revenue you gotta cut something on the other side of the balance sheet Anon.”

    Actually, only if you have a real job or a real company. That’s a principle of GAAP – Generally Accepted Accounting Principles, which allow one to know where a company really stands. Unfortunately the US Govt does not conform to the GAAP standards *which it imposes on everybody else*. In that case, you can do what Hussein and his boys are doing: print more money to cover it. Of course that is just smoke and mirrors; the basic laws of finance dictate that you cannot create value from thin air. Money, yes. Value, no.

  389. Not really a big fan of the change, seems confusing. I am also not in favor of the idea of a thought police coming in and editing or deleting posts as Donna suggests. I think what makes his place interesting is the diversity of ideas. You get onto a slippery slope pretty fast when you try run things this way IMO. Where do you draw the line? When is a post one post too many. Do I decide not to post what I am really thinking for fear of being blocked or deleted? I dont think I would even bother at that point. It would be a good way though to make sure you had a place where everyone thought as you did though, so there is that.

  390. I love it Matthew! Thanks for keeping the porch in such good working order.

  391. Much prefer the new format. Would very much like it to be combined with possible deletion of multiple comments by same person. Although there is one person who regularly does that, it would have the effect of keeping the rest of us a little more circumspect.

  392. Mattew: I’d like to see the post in chronological order with the oldest first and the newest last. Personally, I like the old format as I can just end page to get to the latest comments. Now, I have to click on “Older/Newer Comments” if I want to get to the end. This new format is not an improvement in my book. I suspect I will find your new format annoying enough that I won’t bother to read the comments.
    Thanks.
    Iris

  393. Matthew,

    My vote… Instead of newest on top, I like to see new comment post under the last one. So I would want to be under anon May 16, 2012 at 11:32 PM, on this page. That way I read posts in chronological order.

    Thanks! It will be much faster loading when your grandmother takes her time between posts.

  394. is it my imagination or did these posts get shuffled all around?

  395. Lori, you have already received your financial creds on this site, you can stop explaining it again and again. At the end of the day ALL spending. Obama spent 6 trillion in 3 1/2 years. Bush 5 trillion in 8 years. No other way to divide that out.

  396. It may look to many of you that Obama has increased the debt more than Mr. Bush, but that’s because that while Mr. Bush bankrolled a decade long multi-front war and a huge new Medicare boondoggle, (which was a mammoth new welfare entitlement for Big Pharma, as well all know)none of these expenditures were funded. They were “paid for” by special Congressional budget supplemental bills that never got onto the Federal Budget. Mr. Obama, immediately upon taking office, put those trillions of unfunded programs on the budget where they could be seen for what they are. That’s what happened with the debt spiral: we call it Republican smoke and mirrors.

  397. From Matt:

    All. Please give me feedback on the comment string. I have adjusted the setting so that comments are now divided into pages with the most recent page containing the 20 most recent comments. That way you don’t have to scroll through all the comments to get to the most current conversation.

    If this format is not better, let me know and I can try others or go back to the default.

    Also, I have not done anything that would send email responses to anyone. Sorry 99ts but I don’t know anything about the emails that you are getting.

    Thanks for feedback.

  398. or follow the link in one of the emails to “manage my subscriptions” and delete the ones/all you want as far as posts which you don’t want emails from…

  399. http://www.cagle.com/2012/05/the-bully-2/

  400. 99ts-
    be sure to UNcheck the “notify me of… ” box <——- next to the post comment button.
    Wordpress has made that a default checked box in recent days- eek!
    If you have a WP account you can also go there and uncheck posts you do not want to follow via email.

  401. NOP – not sure I understand your question. But that is what Zimmerman claimed that Martin initiated it by punching Z in the nose and banging his head on the pavement and Z feared for his life. But then, if that is true, what caused Martin to fear Zimmerman? One brought a bag of Skittles and Ice Tea to the fight and the other brought a loaded gun/weapon. In the past there would not have been a gun or the “right” to use it. It would have been a shouting match or a fist fight. We will only know one side to the story.

    The law is wrong IMO. If you are allowed to carry concealed anywhere and use it then perhaps you should be made to carry insurance. You have car insurance because a car can kill or maim(sp?) why is a gun different? Here is another one.

    http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2012/03/21/tonight-on-ac360-florida-shooter-claims-stand-your-ground-defense/

    “It all started on a neighborhood basketball court in a suburb of Tampa. The two men got into an altercation over a teenager skateboarding on the court. Dooley was shouting at the teenager to get off the court, and James intervened. After a struggle, Dooley shot James once in the heart. He died in front of his 8-year-old daughter. Kanina James told me she’s worried about her daughter because she doesn’t want to talk about that day and keeps it all bundled inside. She’s seeing a therapist but it’s not really working. Kanina James believes the Stand Your Ground law is like a free pass to murder.”

    Peace.

  402. Congratulations Lori! You qualify to be Tim Geitner’s assistant.

  403. Just a comment to stop the hundreds of emails from wordpress – love you Margaret & Helen but can’t handle the emails

  404. When has our government ever done that? Are you suggesting that it is normal practice for our government to cut spending when it gives a tax break? I would very much like to see some examples that show a direct correlation of cuts to spending.

  405. just a post to STOP the 200 comments fromwordpress

  406. when you cut revenue you gotta cut something on the other side of the balance sheet Anon.

  407. I am 100% serious lori, explain please.

  408. lori, by your logic, I would be a millionaire, if I had a million dollars!

  409. LOL LOL Anonymous, seriously?

  410. Something I don’t understand lori.(Bush’s tax cuts, that were NOT paid for)

    How can a tax cut be paid for? The money was taken by the government from the people that earned it. This statement just doesnt make any sense.

  411. Bush grew government by 70 percent. It has grown even more under Obama, but there is no way W was even a smidgen conservative. NO effin’ WAY! Neither party will shrink government.

  412. Obama’s Father Exposed As Anti-White Terrorist By British, U.S. Intel

    http://westernjournalism.com/obamas-father-exposed-as-anti-white-terrorist-by-british-u-s-intel/

  413. exactly Far.. thanks. ;-)

  414. Backgammon, I said Bush ADDED more to the debt, than Obama, which he has. Bush’s tax cuts, that were NOT paid for, and the war, which ALSO was not paid for, adding up to close to 3 TRILLION.

    Obama’s stimulus was somewhere around 83 billion.

    Has the debit increased more under Obama? YES

    … of course it has.. With the lost revenue and the compound interest and Obama’s stimulus package, AND, let us not forget Obama added the wars to the books which Bush conveniently left off, of course it increased at a faster rate! The deb it is rasing every minute even with NO new spending…

    I’m sure you understand that distinction. Right?

    As far as the surplus I’m not going to argue about those numbers. The GOP claims Clinton borrowed off of other funds in order to claim a surplus. That is not true. Check your facts there.

  415. Just because the info came from A CBS correspondent doesn’t make it unbiased. I read several of his articles and he has a definite right slant.

    From Crooks and Liars:

    “What Knoller doesn’t specify, naturally, is what the debt was when Bush began his presidency. And that’s a glaring omission, because unless you don’t know that, you can’t accurately compare the records. So here it is.

    In 2001, the national debt Bush inherited was around $5.7T, give or take. Some of that debt in 2001 has to be attributed to Clinton, just as some of the debt in 2009 when Obama took office has to be attributed to Bush. When W. left office in 2009, the debt was nearly $11T. That’s an increase of 89 percent.

    Under Obama, the debt has increased from about $11T to about $15T, about 40 percent.

    And what’s behind that increase? Historically low taxes and historically low revenues — and the worst financial crash since the 1930s. There’s been no “binge” in spending, as Knoller wants you to believe.”

    http://crooksandliars.com/blue-texan/cbss-mark-knoller-falsely-claims-debt-h

  416. Question: If Mr. Martin stood his ground and decked Mr. Zimmerman, how does that help Mr. Zimmerman’s case?

  417. National Debt has increased more under Obama than under Bush
    (Credit: CBS)
    Lori, your figures are way off. There was no surplus when Bush took office,
    (I wish).

    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-57400369-503544/national-debt-has-increased-more-under-obama-than-under-bush/?tag=re1.Channel

    A nice little color chart! Basically Bush was bad, but Obama is worse.
    This is CBS, Not crooks N liars or Huffington post or michael moore.

  418. Let me try again, Tina. I wouldn’t have, but for the apparent dig about me trying to “control” what people say on this blog.

    I am a strong supporter of President Obama. I don’t agree with everything he has done but I certainly think he has accomplished a great deal and I both hope he will be re-elected and will work hard towards that goal.

    However, I have seen the first term of his Presidency marred by the careless repetition, embellishment, and spreading of things that aren’t true. And, unfortunately, there are people who will believe those things. So I don’t care to see it happen. And I believe that, when it is done about a candidate that I oppose, it costs credibility in terms of what may be genuine issues of concern.

    That is why I objected to you reporting that there were “stories” about a particular incident. To date, I have not seen anything approaching proof of it. If I ever do see proof, I’ll evaluate it and, if it seems credible, it certainly will have an impact on my view of Romney. But it will be to further validate my view that he is a bully and someone who finds the misfortune of others to be either amusing or not of interest. NOT someone I’d want as this country’s President.

    Lori is correct: there are substantiated incidents of bullying. And Romney’s reaction to being confronted with them is troubling to me. But I believe that those confirmed incidents lose their credibility when people spread other stories that either cannot be confirmed or will be discredited. And this election is too important for me to want that to happen. Besides, it’s just wrong.

    No, the internet does not “make me crazy.” It is a valuable tool and has many wonderful things. But there are downsides to it and spreading false stories are one of them. Do I want to control what people say? Well, to the extent that I asked you to not spread a story that had not been proven, I suppose you could view it that way. But I will continue to object when people spread unsubstantiated stories, regardless of who that story is about. And if you don’t like that, that’s your business.

  419. fanned cynthia!

  420. pf –

    “It certainly seems to bolster his case. (Note this is ABC, not Fox)”

    There will only be one side to this story since Martin is dead and there were no witnesses as such.
    We don’t know what Zimmerman said to Martin (or M to Z) that led to the escalation of the situation. Did Zimmerman identify himself? Martin could have been the one who felt threaten and he punches/knocks Z to the ground and holding him down while yelling for help. Z pulls his gun and in close range, his arm bent, pulls the trigger. The recoil(?) of the gun kicks back hitting Z in the nose and banging his head on the pavement. Why did Z wait until the next day to seek medical attention? We only have Zimmerman’s side and he is going to protect himself. Z’s injuries prove nothing as they fail to show how they happened, IMO.

    IMO the law is wrong. Placing guns in the hands of unqualified, untrained, insecure, fearful people or wantabe hero is a disaster in the making. Z’s injuries are hardly worth anyone dying for. Now we have a dead teenager and a man who will probably get off but who will live in fear for a long time. Just my 2 cents.

    Peace.

  421. Yep UAW, This week both sides can find polls to be optimistic about and some not so much.

    Even considering that is a Rassie poll, I don’t like it. I would like to have NC in a 3-5 point grasp going into the convention. We shall see……..

    There were others out this week however that made me jump up and down.. Pennsylvania being one of them.

  422. yep Lori….

    North Carolina: Romney 51%, Obama 43%

    http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/elections/election_2012/election_2012_presidential_election/north_carolina/election_2012_north_carolina_president

  423. Time and exit polls will tell if it caused Undecided’s to change there mind UAW..

    My gut tells me it won’t be THE reason a person doesn’t vote for Mittens, but I do think it will help push the pile.

    I do have a caveat to that though, and that is IF these stories continue to drip drip out and consume even more news cycles and cause Roms to be knocked off message. Then I think it will matter to Undecided’s .

    Mittens is a horrible candidate. Even the most loyal GOP ers concede that… but will that be enough to over come the economy malaise?? I donno.. But I think it’s gonna be a barn burner.

  424. yep Lori…”people can take from the “pranks” what they want.” and I think people are trying to “read” more into this than whats there……

  425. yep UAW.. people can take from the “pranks” what they want. But there is no doubt there were “panks, or bullying” whatever you want to call it. And there are more stories comign out daily. Time will tell if anything political will come of the drip drip drip ..

    Jusssss passin on facts is all. ;-)

  426. great CBS article Lori….
    “In later years, after Romney went on a Mormon mission, married and raised five sons, he seemed a different person to some old classmates. “Mitt began to change as a person when he met Ann Davies. He gradually became a more serious person. She was part of the process of him maturing and becoming more of the person he is today,” said Jim Bailey, who was a classmate of Romney’s at Cranbrook and later at Harvard.”

  427. just catching up…hope everyone had a great mothers day……
    not that i agree with bulling but its been said a couple of times that Mitt cut a gays hair…….right around 1965-1966…..IMHO if Mitt cut his hair it was because he had long hair, not being gay…..

  428. No pf perhaps YOU need to get your facts straight.. Once again YOU have shown your ignorance on the subject of Mitt and the numerous other bullying stories.

    Perhaps if you spent more time reading and less time thinking about me your posts would be more relevant.

    CBS reports … informed people decide…

    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-502223_162-57431861/mitt-romneys-prep-school-classmates-recall-pranks-but-also-troubling-incidents/?pageNum=2&tag=contentMain;contentBody

  429. “As Tina suggests it’s probably wise to wait and see if there is any fire to this smoke.”

    Donna, I think it is kind of ironic to see us on the same side, but you might want to stand back; I am about to cuss.

    IT IS NOT WISE. IT IS DISHONEST. Lori, what the hell country did YOU go to school in? HERE, in THIS country we don’t convict people on the fire-smoke rule; we try to behave honestly, not engage in innuendo, lynching, “where there’s smoke, there’s fire” or any other dishonest behavior. We may disagree on whether behavior as a teen bears upon behavior as a presidential candidate, but I would suggest – once again – that you get your facts straight before you shoot off your mouth. So far you have been about zero for five, as to my last count, and this doesn’t improve your credibility much.

    There is plenty to criticize Romney – and Obama – on, without making stuff up or repeating unsubstantiated rumour. All this kind of nonsense does is give the Right something to point at and say, “See, they are complete liars and not to be trusted.”

  430. Donna, the internet must make you crazy :) You’ll never be able to control what people do or do not say … although that seems to be what you try to do on this blog.

  431. I am not certain that it did not happen. But I have seen nothing to suggst that it did. The “source” was a humor column. If there is a point where, as is the case with the hair-cutting incident, witnesses confirm it, then I will believe it happened.

    To me, seeing a number of references to something is relatively inconsequential in the day of the internet. For example, think of the dozens of times that the “Michelle Obama ordered the lobster in the New York hotel” story was repeated. Turns out that it wasn’t true–the hotel records prove it. Similarly, the story about the President’s birth certificate and the supposed “sealing” of records has been repeated ad infinitum. The fact of repetition doesn’t add one whit to the veracity of the story, which has been thoroughly debunked.

    There are so many examples, many of which have been spread on this blog. And simply because a story may appear in one, four, or dozens of sites does not make it one that should either be believed or disseminated.

    I am a lawyer and I look at evidence–something that can be and has been corroborated. And I see the harm that is caused by spreading stories based on other stories. It is wrong regardless of who does it or about whom it is done.

  432. Donna, Tina is correct there have been more stories coming out in the last few days about Romney’s “so called childish pranks”. As Tina suggests it’s probably wise to wait and see if there is any fire to this smoke.

    Also yes, Borowitz did do a parody about the story/s. Two differnt subjects.

  433. Donna, I appreciate your stance, but am puzzled about why you are so certain that the stair incidents didn’t happen. The hair-cutting story was poo-pooed as inaccurate too, until it was investigated and mostly proved. Right now people are investigating Mitt’s supposed bullying of a kid with disabilities, I’ve seen enough references to it to think it happened; you say it did not happen. We’ll have to wait for the stories to unfold, I guess.

  434. Yes, the parody was based on actual things that happened. But the supposed pushing a handicapped kid downstairs was not one of those actual things–that was the parody. When you say that there are “reports coming out” about an incident that didn’t happen, you are not publicizing the actual events but, instead, are publishing something that did not happen.

    Sorry but I am as impatient when an inaccurate story is spread about someone who I don’t support as when such a story is spread about someone I do support.

  435. (If you’re referring to the Borowitz parody here, that is : http://www.borowitzreport.com/2012/05/11/my-school-days/ )

  436. Donna, the parody was based upon actual things that happened.

  437. Tina: I am no fan of Romney’s and believe that his reaction to the bullying incident and “practical joke” against a sight-impaired teacher says a great deal about him. However, you are not speaking of an actual incident. This was in a parody article about Romney, was clearly labeled as such, and unfortunately has been picked up and spread as fact. Take that off your list of things to dislike.

  438. Tina – sounds interesting.

    Do you have any cites on that?

  439. There are also reports coming out about Mitt pushing a handicapped kid down the stairs several times. We don’t need a creep like that in the White House!

  440. Interesting: medical report on George Zimmerman:

    http://abcnews.go.com/US/george-zimmerman-medical-report-sheds-light-injuries-trayvon/story?id=16353532#.T7OcNp9YsWB

    It certainly seems to bolster his case. (Note this is ABC, not Fox)

  441. http://www.snopes.com/politics/romney/search.asp

    http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/r/Romney-NYC-Missing-
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/…missing…romney…/gIQA1EENpR_blog...

    jacksonville.com/…/fact-check-story-about-mitt-romney-and-missing

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/…/mitt-romney-melissa-gay_n_1355317.ht

  442. “How many heads has that hydra had?” None with a brain in it.

    I think the message is “I am an unstoppable bully,” which is Republicanism defined and well represented by this bozo.

    I only comment again because so many feel they have to say something in response to the blather. But, doing so is an invitation. Encouragement. Eventually, bullies who are completely ignored get bored and wander off looking for someone else to annoy. By even posting this, I too am encouraging, but it’s a worthwhile thing to think about and train yourself to put into action.

    It would be easier if they had an “ignore” option. Maybe they do. I just signed up the other day. It’s tempting to engage when you’re wired to debate, use logic, consider reasonable arguments and try to weed out lies before they might spread, but it’s better to let it go. If you are dealing with a reasonable person, it’s reasonable to make the effort. This, however, is not the case here. In fact, the Internet allows all of the little incessant bullies a way to get the job done from a safe place and watch the chaos. The devil has so many advocates, it requires a policy if one wants to avoid unreasonable and unresolve-able conflict, because that is their specific goal. Your anger.

    I’m not bothered by it. Truly. All they do is alienate everyone else and show the swing voters which side they really, really do not want to associate with. So, all good. All that exhaustive effort is put to good use, however odoriferous it may be, like black mold, among the thoughtful and fun posts of the enlightened.

    My wife is reading a great book on the subject of dealing with these types of sociopaths, of which, some wind up murdering their victims who cannot figure out how to get rid of them. What they learn after harassing you 100 times before you finally respond is just that. It takes 100 times. Success. And a proven strategy for how to get the satisfaction of doing it some more. So, don’t feed the trolls, ever. Let them go hungry and wander off. And when they come back, to check and see if they can get any bites, you know what to do. Smile and enjoy the good.

    Just my advice. :)

    Have a great day!

  443. Good job ladies.

    How many heads has that hydra had? I lost count. I think someone was asking earlier for a head count.

    Carrion.

  444. Watch it now!

    Wooly Bully

  445. This is fun. Like an old college exercise. :grin:

    Nasty And Gross In Cahoots
    Naive Asinine Gibberish Infested Cranium
    Not Another Goober Is Crazier
    Now Aliens Got Internet Connections
    Never Allow Ghoul Inside Cabin
    Near Any Girl I Cry
    No Alternative Gas Is Contained
    Noah Always Gets It Canned

  446. “Not a Glimmer In Cerebrum.”

  447. Darn! and after I finally figured out what Nagic stood for – No Answer Given Is Creditable.
    Doesn’t he realize his “message” and behavior is a dead give away?

    Peace.

  448. Are you kidding me? It’s pathetic enough that Noah/Nagic spends virtually all of his life on this blog, spouting lies about himself and about public figures. But to go to those lengths? What a complete loser. His “message?” It’s “I’m an uninformed sad sack without a life.”

  449. nagic posts at Rutheford’s: “Ahh the ladies finally banned together to ban me again at M & H. PFesser, remember you asking about the whole hydra thing? Every time I tried to answer you they would delete my response. I had to and will again resort to proxy servers to get my message across which requires a number of name changes to keep them guessing.”

    Persistant little toad, no?

  450. Isn’t that the point, Backgammon? The hosts don’t believe it was “a trite.” The hosts believe it was reflective of Mr. Romney’s character. I agree with them and it appears that several others do as well.

    Your view is that the President is “radical and Incompetitent (sic)”–which is a matter of opinion that you are entitled to hold. You also refer to the President as “pot smoking,” although I trust you agree that nobody suggests he does so now. Yes, he did try recreational drugs when he was younger–and he admits that. I, for one, view his honesty on the subject to be admirable.

    As for the whole feigned confusion about “what’s so bad about calling him ‘Hussein?'” that’s simply childish. Yes, it is his middle name. But it is being used deliberately, to try to taunt people. It’s as childish and inane as someone like Sean Hannity with his apparent inability to refer to a Democrat without a pejorative nickname. It’s as immature as constantly referring to the President as “the anointed one” or the “Messiah,” as a way to make fun of the perceived deification of him–that, with virtually no exceptions, does not exist. And certainly doesn’t exist to any greater extent than the people who portray Sarah Palin as the incarnation of all that is good and wondrous.

    A child or young person’s nickname is not an “alias.” It is exactly what it is: a nickname. And it’s no different than someone who is “Susie” who grows up to go by “Susan” or “Tad” growing up to be “Thomas.” And a child’s use of a step parent’s last name while living with that step parent is hardly adopting equivalent to a criminal using a false identity to try to commit an offense.

    It is the nasty little sniping that is so reflective of right wing radio and cheap commentary on blogs. It’s not funny or clever or anything more than junior high level snarkiness. When Rush Limbaugh can’t say “office” but has to, ad nauseum, say “orifice,” it’s stupid and juvenile. When some yutz on a blog uses terms like “Obummer” or “Obozo” or the like, they are demonstrating the intellect of a chipmunk. And it’s no more appealing when someone on the left uses terms like “Rethuglican” or “Repugs.”

    Perhaps that answers your question about the “alias?” Although I trust that it was hardly meant sincerely.

  451. Yeah Backgammon. A trite certainly demands an adverse discussion.

  452. Hal, perhaps you didn’t notice the ole gals were bashing a Presidential candidate for a trite, while ignoring the radical, incompetitent, pot smoking guy in the WH.
    I think that calls for some adverse discussion.

  453. Some of you just need to get over yourselves a bit and look at the banner. This is supposed to be fun. And I am pretty sure the menu calls for progressive or at least open minded.

  454. Soreoto was his stepfather’s surname. Barry was short for Barack. What’s the problem?

  455. Geroge Bush was known at Kegs Alot in college and Gerald Ford was better known as Two Lefts Ford.

  456. I am less concerned about the Hussain in Obama’s name than the former names he was known by:
    Barry Soreoto
    Barry Obama
    Do you know any other Presidents who had alias names? I can’t find any.

  457. Fan that SShaver!

  458. If my body could be the same man that I was at 20, I’d accept as a compliment that I haven’t changed in 37 years. Boy howdy!!!

  459. As a writer, I do tend to believe that character is destiny. The problem is not that Romney did a cruel thing when he was young, but that as a mature man, he chuckled about it.

  460. Sorry Julie. You are right to a degree but you have also missed a couple of years of history that realllly matter. You can enjoy Helen and Margaret even if you’re no interested in the comments.

  461. Pfesser,

    I think I owe you an apology. I made a statement that you had changed a stance on voting for Obama if Mitt got the GOP nomination. It is now my thought that I had you confused with another poster. For this, I apologize.

    Concerning trolls: I don’t consider you, UAW, James or Rutherford as trolls on this blog. Noah/nagic, on the other hand is an entirely different matter. If you can’t make the distinction then so be it. When it comes to this specific blog and his behavior, I believe you make false equivalencies considering trollish behavior (that would be your prerogative) and I think it is misguided (that would be mine).

    Although I like Barack Hussein Obama’s middle name, I understand the childish motivation behind using it in this political circle. When I witnessed you, who I consider an intelligent, thoughtful, well reasoned (at least in the framework of your own political belief system) and relatively civil person using the name here within, I was more than shocked. I truly believe that you are above this behavior. While doing a little bit of research last night, I found that I wasn’t the only one with this reaction as Rutherford expressed his dismay. Like him, I expect that childish behavior from Noah. But you?!? I have come to expect better from you.

  462. Ladies, if it were possible to adopt you both as my grandmothers l would do so in a heartbeat!!

  463. Mitt Romney lept ahead of President Obama in a new nationwide poll Monday. The New York Times/CBS poll showed Romney at 46 percent and Obama at 43 percent.
    It is clear that this election will be about the economy & jobs. Not sex or hair cutting.

  464. If a man at 50 is the same man he was at 20 then he has wasted 30 years!

    Peace.

  465. I wanted to enjoy this blog and laugh, kind of like “Off their Rockers” with Betty White, but instead I didn’t. I stopped by for a visit, but won’t be back. The comment thread was very hostile and the political ranting on both sides really ruined what could have been a good thing. Name calling and insulting readers who may not share your opinions isn’t going to increase readership. If you even care about that or not… maybe you only want liberal readers who attack other readers in the comment thread. It’s a shame too, you could have been on to something!

  466. Jamie Dimond needs to get off the NY Fed! Glass Stegal needs to be put back on the books. The 2 Billion dollar loss by JP Morgan says taking away Glass Stegal was a huge mistake. Eliaqbeth Warren explains:

    http://crooksandliars.com/susie-madrak/elizabeth-warren-calls-dimon-resign-n

  467. Nagic,
    We get it. You hate President Obama and Liberals. Enough.

  468. Tea Party Racists? Really? It is the Liberal party that has enslaved this nations poor with their welfare programs.

  469. Canter 2012
    If Obama is for it
    I am against it!
    Canter 2012
    The above should be the Canter bumper sticker. Actually, it should be a Republican Party bumper sticker.

    Deficit reduction is a hoax put up to distract from JOBS, JOBS, JOBS and the PARTY OF NO’s VOTING RECORD.

    http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/mike-friends-blog/deficit-reduction-great-distraction

  470. I agree Lori!!! and he has done this while a Conservative Tea Partying racists have fought him tooth & nail with a sole agenda to get rid of him , protecting the most wealthy of this country, while letting the middle class & poor sink into oblivion…President Obama has tried to be a nice guy the entire time… something the troll and others cannot possible comprehend the meaning of…

  471. Exaxtly JJ

    The Bush’s tax cuts and wars amounted to over 3 TRILLION. Plus he had a massive surplice when he took office and massive revenue coming in.

    Obama’s stimulus was something like 83 billion.( Some economists argue that wasn’t enough). You add to that the loss of revenue the housing crisis caused and you have an enormous debt that needs to be addressed by a TWO sided approach. Cut cost and add revenue.. It’s a balancing act indeed. But one Obama and his team has done with remarkable skill. But the important thing to remember he was faced with THE WORST economic crisis this country has seen since the great depression day ONE in office.

    In just 3 short years he has yanked us back from utter colaspe of our economy.. I think that alone gives him the street cred for 4 more years.

  472. Who caused the economic downturn? NOT PRESIDENT OBAMA! It was two unfunded wars, tax cuts and and economic downturn caused by GW BUSH and his de-regulation, gamble, gamble, gamble policies. Check out the chart.

    http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/05/obama-romney-deficit-debt-chart.php

    Canter has lost support by beating his own chest over failed policies and ideas – reminds me of a troll. Lots of money will be spent in trying to polish the turd but a turd is a turd, even if polished.

  473. The response will be the same: check snopes or factcheck. Inflammatory and pejorative rhetoric are not facts. Noah/Nagic’s mindless repetition of talking points is not truth. This has been a valuable exercise for one reason: it demonstrates the sheer dishonesty of his “sources” and his willingness to parrot them.

    No, Noah–this is not going to become yet another day when you engage in your pattern of throwing out falsehoods and I respond with actual facts. First, I am going to work. Second, I doubt that you have any credibility with anyone here (although people, of course, form their own conclusions). If you had ever demonstrated a shred of intellectual honesty, I’d suggest that you start verifying material before you spread it further. Because you have not, I’ll simply note that you proved Elsie’s point about particularly noxious blog tactics. I do hope that the hosts determine at some point that it’s simply not worth allowing you to engage in them further.

    Personal attack in lieu of a substantive response? The substantive responses gain nothing but more rubbish from you. You are truly an empty hole. And truly excellent conservative minds such as Buckley would find you embarassing and abhorrent.

  474. It would be nice, if it ended with Britain. But Obama seems intent on taking even more countries off our allied list.

    Following his lead with U.S.-Britain relations, President Obama has been no friend to Israel either. Friends with those who consider the Jewish State the “biggest obstacle to peace” in the region, the president snubbed Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu in much the same way he snubbed brown when refusing to share dinner with the Israeli leader. This of course seems small in comparison to the monumental sell-out that occurred when Obama’s declared to the world that Israel should “return” to its “1967 borders.” Nevermind the fact that there are no such borders but rather armistice lines, and that in either case, they are equally indefensible.

    Of course, no mention of the president’s stance on Israel would be complete without mentioning his former instructor and friend, the late Edward Said. The pro-Palestinian activist and Columbia University professor openly condemned Israel, which he considered to be an illegitimate, colonialist state.

    In 1998 Obama attended a speech by Said in which the scholar called for a campaign “against settlements, against Israeli apartheid.” Given Obama’s apparent animus towards nations he deems “colonizers,” it comes as no surprise that he has abandoned one of America’s greatest ally, indeed the greatest ally in the Middle East.

    When examining the president’s view on Israel it also becomes clear why his administration supports the rise of the Muslim Brotherhood — a group whose own cleric recently declared that it was sending an army of martyrs to establish a Caliphate in Jerusalem.

    Ironically, administration official James Clapper infamously declared that the Muslim Brotherhood is in fact “secular.” Meanwhile, a new barrage of rocket-fire into Israel has begun emanating from the Sinai. But perhaps that is just a coincidence!?!

  475. “Eric Cantor has less than 30% approval rating in his home state of Virginia.
    His negatives are over 50%.”

    You can add me to that list. I am well and truly fed up with these people.

  476. Well, and exquisitely written. Spot-on!

  477. Exhibit A in Elsie’s analysis is Nagic/Noah’s post purporting to respond to his lie about the First Lady. Yes, she has the number of aides that he claims she has. No, that is not different from other First Ladies. Snopes walks through the figures for the others. By selectively quoting certain information which he appears to have obtained from Snopes, Nagic/Noah attempts to avoid that Mrs. Bush’s own staff secreary confirmed the higher number. And he leaves out the numbers for the other First Ladies.

    This is less about one particular inept troll who has absolutely no credibility and has repeatedly demonstrated that he comes here in order to spread lies than it is about the need to check facts and source material. Although Noah/Nagic is ineffective, Elsie is correct that his attempted (but failed) tactics are what certain politicians and commentators who lack integrity will continue to push on the public. He is of no interest himself, but his actions are what we need to watch for and vigorously repond to. Truth is the best disinfectant.

  478. What is really comical, is all this proof for Pi that I have been right about Liberals all along. I mean look at you all, rather than talk about anything of substance,(because you know you cannot defend Liberalism) you attack little ol me, and go on and on about..trolls? Thanks for my morning chuckle.

    Told ya so Pi.

  479. Poor trolls. Very sad. They must get something out of it though or they wouldn’t be posting again and again. I don’t care to feed the trolls. They can’t help themselves. Nothing can change the way they think. It is, quite literally the opposite of being a progressive minded person. They believe their thoughts with all their might and facts and information are subject to those preconceived ideas.

    So, I do not bother to address them or ever reply to them. That’s rule number one in dealing with the unbalanced. Do not engage. However, I am more than happy to comment about them. My comments are for the less severely afflicted folks out there who are willing to think and to learn and for everyone else who already does those things naturally to consider.

    One of the frequent arguments I have been hearing from pretty much everywhere is that we shouldn’t question Mitt’s behavior before…well, we don’t have a time frame that is acceptable to question him about, but is sure is unfair that we talk about this. With the next breath, we get the child like line from them, “And what about Obama. Because, you know, Mitt didn’t do anything wrong, but oh that Obama, he’s just as bad!” To me that seems a self defeating argument. I didn’t steal a cookie. But so did Obama!

    Kind of like the imaginary Clinton hit list, there is also the supposed lack of information about Obama, but then magically, they can go on to quote at length with gleeful derision the fine details Obama himself wrote about his own experiences and how they affected and changed him and led to more positive thinking and actions as a result. Obama went out of his way to not only write the book, but narrated it in his own voice. Talk about taking ownership of your past and putting it out there for the world to judge.

    It does appear to me that Obama actually is steadily raked back and forth over the coals for every comment he’s made and things that occurred to him or were done by him, as a child, as a teenager, as a college student, doing work to help his community, as a professional, as a politician and certainly as a President. Every possible comment is stamped on him as though he is that person, nothing has or ever will change about him and should you show otherwise how he has developed throughout his life, well then you’re probably a crack addict too.

    Sometimes, honesty and the honor of admitting your own mistake is just not an option, I guess. Pile on top of all that the never ending list of things that are absurdly false that so many folks simply choose to believe and one could have an embolism wondering why we can’t see that we’re the ones causing all the problems in the world.

    Mitt, if you believe him, cannot even recall this particular incident. He tells us he does not doubt it happened. He says he did a lot of stupid things back then. It surely begs the question to be asked, “if you cannot recall this incident, what DO you recall?” Clearly he recalls doing stupid things. So…what were they? If this was so trivial as to be beneath his recollection, even when it has been brought up and discussed, commented on and agreed with by his cohorts who readily admit being involved and note that for them it was absolutely stamped on their memories after the fact as being an awful experience. What else should we know about Mitt that he CAN recall if this little beneath notice event isn’t worth discussing? Do tell, what is?

    Okay, there’s my one post. First one here. Best of luck to all. Hope you enjoy the good and hope for better on the behalf of the rest. :)

  480. If you are curious to see how our trolls are trained, you might want to take a look at the commentary at the following link. Most importantly, if you want to understand why carefully prepared refutations get you nowhere with these bullies, this just might do it for you:

    “Deciphering Karl Rove’s Playbook:
    Campaign Tactics and Response Strategies”

    http://www.webster.edu/medialiteracy/journal/FINALKARLROVE.pdf

    This well-researched and informative article identifies the fifteen tactics that comprise the Rovian campaign strategy.

    A brief list of the tactics follows. However, I recommend you go to that link and actually read that article in its entirety. It breaks down how American politics and the country itself have been poisoned over the years by the Rovian machine to the benefit of the Gee Oh Pee.

    ***
    It all begins with:
    “Much of George W. Bush’s political success can be attributed to his chief political strategist, Karl Rove. Often referred to as “Bush’s Brain”, Rove has orchestrated each of Bush’s successful political campaigns…”

    “The Rovian Playbook” — Each tactic begins with a thorough description. Then the use of each particular tactic is illustrated in the Bush campaigns. The authors conclude by identifying Strategic Responses that counter these campaign tactics.

    Tactic #1: Take the Offensive
    Tactic #2: Attack Your Opponent’s Strengths
    Tactic #3: Accuse Your Opponent of What He/She is Going to Accuse You Of
    Tactic #4: Go Negative, Then Cry Foul
    Tactic #5: The “Big Lie”
    Tactic #6: Appeal to Moral Values
    Tactic #7: Sell the Bush Persona
    Tactic #8: Sell an Adolescent Worldview
    Tactic #9: Exploit the Media
    Tactic #10: Create Straw Issues
    Tactic #11: Employ Surrogates
    Tactic #12: Use Emotional Appeals
    Tactic # 13: Rely on Expert Testimonials
    Tactic #14: Rhetorical Devices
    Tactic #15: Use of Language

    Take a look at the information behind the tactics. It will sound exceedingly familiar to you.

    And there is nothing to indicate any of that is going away.

    So, we all need to arm ourselves with knowledge about these Rovian routines and learn how to counter them (see the “Strategic Responses”), tedious as that sounds.

  481. This popped up on the Internet a while back. I found it interesting; perhaps you might, as well.

    ***
    TACTICS FOR EFFECTIVE CONSERVATIVE BLOGGING
    By Karl Rove

    Engage
    Demand an elaborate, time-consuming comparison / analysis between your position and theirs.

    Entangle
    Insist that the Liberal put their posts in their own words. That will consume the most time and effort for the Liberal poster. They will be unable to spread numerous points on numerous blogs if you have them occupied. Allowing a Liberal to post a web link is too quick and efficient for them. Tie them up. We are going for delay of game here.

    Demoralize
    Dismiss their narrative as rubbish immediately. Do not even read it. Once the Liberal goes through the trouble to research, gather, collate, compose and write their narrative your job is to discredit it. Make it obvious you tossed their labor-intensive narrative aside like garbage. This will have the effect of demoralizing the Liberal poster. It will make them unwilling to expend the effort again, and for us, that is a net win

    Attack
    Attack the source. Any Liberal website or information source must be marginalized, trivialized and discounted. Let the blogosphere know that Truthout.org, thinkprogress.org, the nation and moveon.org are Liberal rubbish propaganda. Discredit Liberal sources of information whenever possible.

    Confuse
    Challenge the Liberal position with questions, always questions. The questions need not be relevant. The goal is to knock the Liberal poster off their game, and seize control of the narrative. Once you have control you can direct the narrative to where you want it to go, which is always away from letting the Liberal make their point. Conversely, do not respond to their leading questions. Don’t rise to their bait.

    Contain
    Your job is to prevent the presentation and spread of Liberal viewpoints. Do anything you must do to prevent a Liberal poster from presenting a well-reasoned argument or starting a civil discussion. Don’t allow a Liberal to present their dogma unchallenged EVER.

    Intimidate
    Taunt the Liberals. If you find yourself in a debate with a Liberal where you are losing a fact-based argument, then call them a name to derail their diatribe. Remember your goal is to prevent a meaningful exchange of views and ideas which may portray Liberalism in a positive light.

    Your goal as a conservative blogger is to stop the spread and advance of the Liberal agenda. Play upon any identifiable idiosyncrasies, character flaws, physical traits, names, to their disadvantage. Monitor other posts for vulnerabilities you can exploit. Stay on the offensive with Liberal wimps. Don’t let up.

    Insult their Movement
    Assign as many character and moral flaws to Liberals as you can. You must portray Liberals as weak, vacillating, indecisive, amoral, baby killers, unpatriotic, effete snobs, elitists, Leftists, Commies, sense of entitlement, promiscuous, union lovers, tax raisers, Welfare Queens, Socialists, lazy, sex-obsessed, druggies, Jesus haters, moochers, troop hater, etc. Always use these negative epithets when referring to, or describing Liberals / democrats.

    Deceive
    Identify yourself as a moderate, centrist or independent. It will also cause Liberals to lower their guard a bit, which gives you an effective opening. This may also have the effect of aligning conservative viewpoints with the real moderates we are attempting to reach.

    It may serve to influence some moderates over to the Republican side. Patriotism Always claim the high ground of pro-military, low taxes, strong defense, morality and religion. We own those virtues. Learn how to exploit them when debating

    Demean
    Always refer to the other side as Liberals, Lefty Liberals, Libbies. Never assign them the status of a bona-fide political party. Hang Liberalism around their neck like a burning tire. Make Liberalism appear as a moral turpitude or a character flaw. They are NEVER, NEVER to be referred to as the Democratic Party. At best it is the democrat party. Never assign them respect.

    Opportunity
    Be alert for ways to insert our catch phrases into your narrative. You will receive your daily list of talking points and topics that we want you to cover. Consistent, persistent repetition and inculcation will drive our talking points home and so will neuro-linguistic programming. Stick with it and our talking points will become truth. If they debunk your talking point, ignore it, and move on as if you didn’t hear it.

    http://www.theyoungturks.com/story/2011/8/26/151725/396/Diary/TACTICS-FOR-EFFECTIVE-CONSERVATIVE-BLOGGING-By-Karl-Rove

  482. If you don’t know the difference beteeen crack and blow your opinions on more nuanced matters are, like your spelling, questionable too. Cro-Magnon.

  483. Oh, I love childish. Here’s a classic.

  484. farsight…you need a tissue little man? Or is it just that time of the month?

  485. Eric Cantor has less than 30% approval rating in his home state of Virginia.
    His negatives are over 50%.
    “This poll shows that Virginians are tired of Eric Cantor’s partisan political gamesmanship. Virginians are looking to Congress for solutions — instead, Cantor spends his time on power politics and focused on his own personal political ambitions.”

    http://www.pdacommunity.org/virginia/1584-virginia-voters-overwhelmingly-reject-eric-cantor-

  486. According to the 2009 White House report to Congress, there are 16 people with a title specifically indicating they work for Michelle Obama’s office. In other words, there are 16 people with “first lady” somewhere in their title, such as Jocelyn Frye, deputy assistant to the president and director of policy and projects for the first lady.

    The list reported by Sweet and The Last Crusade, however, includes six other staffers who do not have “first lady” in their title but are a part of the first lady’s office staff, such as Desiree Rogers, special assistant to the president and White House social secretary, and Natalie Bookey, staff assistant.

    We contacted Katie McCormick Lelyveld, Michelle Obama’s press secretary, to check the list’s accuracy. Lelyveld told us in an e-mail that the first lady’s current staff size is actually 24, not 22, as the chain e-mail claims. Lelyveld couldn’t provide a list of the staffers at that time.

    The combined annual salaries for the 22 staffers we can specifically identify as working for Michelle Obama come to $1.6 million.

    Jacqueline Kennedy’s office was “headed” by one person, but said that there were “at least 9 people working for Mrs. Kennedy.

    Hillary Clinton had at least a staff of 13 as of October 1993

    We were able to verify 18 staffers for Laura Bush, as of June 30, 2008. Sixteen people were specifically referred to as a “first lady” staffer, and Amy Zantzinger and Dorothy Thornton served as White House social secretary and deputy social secretary, respectively.

    Dr. Myra Gutin, a professor of communications at Rider University and a first ladies historian, says that the first lady’s role has certainly “grown and evolved” since the 1960s, but generally speaking, the first lady’s “staff numbers about 14-16 on average. This average reflects the post 1960’s First :Ladies.

  487. Ultimately it is Margaret’s, Helen’s and Matthew’s decision to make. Again, I posit that when a poster like you exposes a gross exaggeration for what it is, others take this with them and when confronted with the same BS somewhere else, they reflect on your reasonable and logical argument. I’m choosing to make lemonade out of lemons here as I really have no other choice. My preference would be to see the asshat banished.

  488. I would also direct everyone’s attention to snopes for the truth about the lie Noah is spreading about Mrs. Obama’s aides. In fact, Mrs. Obama has fewer aides than Laura Bush did at the end of GWB’s second term and a comparable number to the balance of his presidency. She has fewer aides than Betty Ford, Lady Bird Johnson, or Mrs. Kennedy.

    Now, this really raises the issue of what several commenters have noted: why do the hosts permit Noah to use this blog to simply spread lies? This sort of thing isn’t a question of holding differing philosophies. Instead, Noah regularly uses this blog to flatly lie about the President, the First Lady, and other public figures. And these are statements that are readily disproven, by publicly available sources or the most basic research/knowledge.

    One great thing about the internet is that it allows genuinely witty, insightful people like Margaret and Helen to share their thoughts with others. But there is a downside: by permitting Noah to comment here, they are providing a forum for what, at best, is gross exaggeration (inflating the President’s admitted former drug use to him being a “crackhead”) and more typically is out and out lying. I respectfully submit that this blog was and should be better than some trash pile like World Net Daily or the hysterical and inaccurate emails that circulate with unfortunate regularity. It’s one thing to hold a different opinion (although one would hope it would be expressed courteously). It’s another to lie about facts.

  489. Helen & Margaret ~
    You are a joy to read. We hope you will both be writing when you hit 100.

  490. I think Mitt’s singular longest held belief on the campaign trail is his stance on Marriage Equality!

  491. Your last comment to me was, as usual, completely off the mark and irrelevant. You obviously have no idea that CroMagnum man was never in North America but “Native Americans” still are. And this might be far beyond your reading capacity but the book Mayflower by Nathaniel Philbrick that came out several years ago, cites through elaborate sources how this land was stolen from the natives through subterfuge and chicanery.
    By the way, your tired and predictable trick of refusing to answer comments by turning your responses into attacks on President Obama or “librules” is beyond tired. It is simply stupid.

  492. Any doubt? That post was to you poolman. Maybe a double post was in order.

  493. I think that video is more spot on than any words you could have posted!

  494. Oh my God! This post answered my own questions. I asked why are modern republicans so mean and so bullying?

    And here is this blogs with many opionions (here are pro Obama people) – when I am not impressed with him – but will vote for him.

    The answer! Look at our neighborhood troll – our beloved nagic! He posts constantly, calls people who disagree with him names, dares people to disagaree etc etc etc. Here a human example of my question!

    Look at his anger? Aaaaaand he has so muuuuuuuch time post never ending posts. Obviously, he is unemployed or underemployed. He is has a transference issue and is belting out any one!

    nagic! Its okay – alot of people have this problem. Open your heart and your mind. You are attacking the wrong people.

  495. Brava Donna!
    Brava Helen! Brava!

  496. Oops, that wasn’t supposed to double post. Matthew, if you’re monitoring, you can remove the second one. Thanks!

  497. Dang! I’m missing all the comedy. :lol: Woo-hoo!! :lol:
    Okay, back to serious…

  498. Is this why Helen and Matthew have such abundant tolerance for the hydra?!? I ask; you decide!

  499. To further elaborate on my previous post and upon further reflection, I’ve had further epiphany. I believe the troll serves a beneficial purpose here. He works at cross purposes to his relentless intent. Due to logical, pointed and well reasoned responses by posters like you, his FUD is refuted for other commenters to peruse and glean benefit. This is decidedly not his twisted intent. I salute you and say, “rock on girl”!!! You do a better job of demolishing his BS in writing than I would ever hope to.

    Maybe we should thank the troll after all! However, I for one, will continue my history of non-response. I will just recline, appreciate and applaud your efforts.

    This kumbya moment is brought to you by a decidedly progressive liberal who appreciates your, message, style, reluctance to accept disinformation and defiant refutation of his pitiful screed.

  500. I don’t feel I have misunderstood but I am willing to put my own question aside – for now – and let’s go back to the list of names you have used so Terri can correctly attribute your comments to you. You stand by your words, so let’s have your list unless it’s sealed?

  501. Ya Anon you again completely misunderstood, purposefully I am sure the Christian thing. But when one can’t argue the points presented, twist them into something else and cry victory.

  502. Great response, point by point. Time to root out the trolls who spoil this forum for the real people.

  503. Donna, touche!!! While you and I have different philosophies on how to address a troll, mine works for me and yours works for you. At the same time, yours debunks and informs. There is a place for exposing the eff’d up disinformation (FUD) and I applaud you for it. I don’t have the desire to spend my time refuting a troll ahole.

    Thank you!!!

    Is there even a micro doubt in your mind concerning the general content of his response!

    Please keep being yourself!!!

  504. I am deeply sorry, nagic. I got your demands mixed up. You make so many of them in your quest to be the center of attention. I was referring to your demand that Terri explain where you said there was something wrong with the name Hussein or Muslims. These are things you have done under various names.

    How’s that list of civil rights being denied to Christians by granting equal rights to others coming along?

  505. Evelyn may or may not respond, Noah. I am happy to do so.

    In your lengthy list of supposedly “sealed” items, there are many that are covered by federal and/or state privacy laws. There are others that simply would not exist based on record retention statutes and typical policies. And there are still others that are subject to privileges that belong to third parties.

    With respect to records that you claim were “sealed,” you are simply inaccurate. For example, school records are confidential by statute. The President did not “seal” anything–the documents already are unavailable to the public. If you are suggesting that he should have voluntarily obtained all of them and released them to the public, I’m not sure why he would do something that no President, other elected official, or candidate has done–or done to the extent that you claim should have been done. This is not “sealing,” which is simply a mindlessly pejorative term you like to use. The documents already have that status, independent of anything that the President has done (and, in fact, he has done nothing to change the status that they have by law).

    Similarly, medical records are, by law, private. You appear not to understand the difference between a record that is, by law, private, and one that is otherwise available but subsequently, by some act of the subject of the record, sealed. It’s a fairly basic point. None of the items you list fall within the latter category.

    The Illinois Senate Schedule is a public document and available pursuant to a state FOIA request. I do not know what you mean by “State Senate records” but virtually anything that would fall within that category is likewise publicly available.

    A “law practice client list” is subject to the attorney/client privilege. As a matter of law, in virtually every state, as well as the Rules of Professional Responsibility in any state that follows that ABA Model Rules (Illinois does) it would be unlawful to release that. Now, if a lawyer files a public document on behalf of a client, the lawyer is obviously and with the client’s consent disclosing the relationship. Those documents are readily available by a search under the lawyer’s name under Pacer (federal court) and state court websites. None of such records have been sealed with respect to the President’s time at the Miner Barnhill firm. Thus, the documents which, by law, can be publicly available are, in fact, publicly available. Those that by law cannot be publicly available are not. The President could do nothing to disclose those because the privilege belongs to the client, not to the lawfirm. Thus, nothing has been “sealed” by him. Anyone who would suggest that a former attorney could, much less should, release a list of their clients simply knows nothing about the attorney/client privilege.

    I do not know about whether selective service registrations are or are not publicly available. You can do your own research there. However, perhaps you can advise which prior presidents, senators, congressmen, or any other candidates made them available. Why the burning desire to see the President’s? I trust your answer will be that this President is so “secretive,” but your claim in that regard is based on the false premise that he sealed records or did not produce what other office-holders have made public.

    Your list includes items pertaining to the President’s birth certificate. That issue has been so thoroughly debunked by so many sources that it does not warrant a response beyond noting that parroting someone of the caliber of Orly Taitz would embarass any but the most low information person. As for the President’s baptismal certificate, that’s a new low, even for you.

    Today you offer a new claim: that Romney did not “seal” facts about the bullying incident. Well, by my freshman year in high school I would have recognized that there is a fundamental difference between facts that were observed by multiple other students (the Romney situation) and records that are required by law to be confidential (what you try to equate to the Romney situation). Romney did not “seal” the stories of his schoolmaters because there would be no way to do so. Again, a false equivalency and certainly nothing that demonstrates “character,” although I am open to the possibility that you define that term differently than pretty much anyone else.

    Michelle Obama gave up her active status as a lawyer. She did so when she took a non-legal position. It is quite common when lawyers move into a business position, and says absolutely nothing about her qualifications as a lawyer or anything else.

    No, the President has not released all academic records. Neither has Romney. Neither has anyone else who you are likely to be able to name. Further, Romney has withheld far more of his adult tax returns than have the Obamas or, indeed, virtually any candidate. It is unfortunately not surprising that you appear untroubled by Romney’s refusal to disclose his financial information, including during the years he has held and run for public office, but you carp about there being no baptismal certificate for the President.

    I expect you will respond with your customary canard about how liberals never debate, they only offer personal attacks. Alternatively, you may seize on one tiny bit of your comments to which I did not respond. However, I believe the above constitutes a more than sufficient substantive response. It is not offered in hopes of dissuading you from continuing to disrupt the blog, but so that others may see the lack of merit in your efforts.

  506. Evelyn, you’ll notice that I have never responded to nagic and all his other aliases regardless of how severely taunted. I refer to him and discuss his behavior but do not respond! He is a circular lying fact twisting asshat of the nth degree. He is the only true troll on this site with the exception of an occasional drive by of Tex . I have repeatedly posted on this site that the most effective way of dealing with him and his ilk is to ignore him. As posters all have their own way of dealing with his immaturity, my suggestions have many times been disregarded. That isn’t a problem and I hold no animosity for those who feel compelled to react to his foolishness and dishonesty. For some, it is just tough to not respond to such scurrilous behavior. Sadly, it plays into his sad excuse for self importance.

    If a period of time goes by that none respond to him, Pfesser, although not a troll himself, encourages nagic and repeatedly stirs the pot. If you went to some of Pfesser’s other haunts and see what he considers adult discussion, you might have a better understanding of his potential mentality (not really sure because one never knows the inner workings of another’s mind/motivation) . On this site where posters tend to be a bit more refined, a desire to lower the bar of civil discourse just seems to be too tempting to pass up I guess.

    Regarding my next to last post where I made it obvious that nagic’s twisted obfuscation of the the truth was totally hilarious and ridiculous, he further twists and obfuscates. A real peach. He is so narcissistic that he always tries to grab the attention! All of the regulars are familiar with and have come to expect this behavior.

    His narcissism is so neurotic in nature that he will absolutely revel in my (this) post. With certainty of encouraging this state of mind, I nonethelss make this post. Further, I admit that he helps me to define myself and thank all the powers that be thatmy being is diametrically opposed to his. I would hate myself if I were like him and appreciate, in a twisted way, how he affirms my self image. I can always learn from and appreciate an obnoxious and disgusting example.

    Sorry folks for encouraging the troll!!

    Now, watch for it.

  507. Odd Evelyn. Can you show us any links that show Obama was required by law to seal all those documents I listed? So then you are saying the information obtained about Romney was illegally obtained and someone needs to go to prison? If they should have been sealed for Obama, then so too they be for Romney…right?

    Just so we are clear, you are saying it is Federal Law that Obama’s Occidental College records, Columbia College records, Columbia Thesis paper, Harvard College records, Selective Service Registration, Medical Records, Illinois Senate schedule, Illinois State Senate records, Law practice client list, Certified copy of Original Birth Certificate:, Signed Embossed paper Certification of Live Birth, Baptism record all must be sealed.

    I look forward to your response, or I should saw non response as I am certain no such laws exist..

  508. Wow – first timer to this blog. well, as mothers, both of you are right. No one ever taught or disciplined this kid for bullying.

    I think his privileged kind just think these poor folks are soooooo funny – just like his poor Irish Setter pooping in fear is so annoying. They had to stop and hose him and the car down – oh boy – what a story! Got to tell everyone.

    Poor prep school boy, poor dog and poor, poor nation. When did mean bullying that is so prevelant in our nation become okay. When did common decency become quaint?

    I don’t understand the mean spiritedness of the modern republicans and the people that follow them. Who are they? Why are they so angry?

    I’m holding my nose and voting for the tool Obama. At least he has vestiges of decency — and I can’t care less if two gays marry.

    I do care if my friends and family can make a living, though.

  509. I agree with Roz and Farsight. Matthew already made clear to Noah/Nagic that he would not be permitted to continue to post on the blog if he was constantly commenting. Enough already, please. If it were simply the lying (Mrs. Obama somehow lost her law license as opposed to going inactive because she wasn’t practicing) or the stupid statements (the President “sealed” materials that, by law, are required to be confidential), or even the constant attacks on others’ integrity and character, it would be bad enough. But he is deliberately disrupting this blog and it’s not fair to those who otherwise enjoy both the posts and the back and forth.

  510. True William. Better to have a former crack head who seals all his records so no one can know what he did in his past. You will note Romney did not have this issue Sealed as Obama has done. We call that Character where I come from.

  511. Poor Mitt cannot remember any of the bullying he did. I’d prefer to not have a president with alzheimers at the get go. And anyway Mitt I don’t like bullies and you are still one. Thanks but no thanks.

  512. ChippyAlvin

    I’ll worry about the Native Americans coming to take back their land right after the Cromagnum man comes back to claim theirs.

  513. So a co-founder of Facebook, a political refugee who owes his life to the US, is acting like any other very rich person, and putting his personal fortune over his other loyalties and obligations: and his choice is OUR fault? His choice, I repeat?

    Does this mean we get credit for Warren Buffett’s choice to remain a US citizen? And Bill Gates’s choice? The choice of the late Steve Jobs?
    I guess it would have been better if he’d stayed and kept his money in the Caymans like Willard does.

  514. The socialists need to be careful about all their tax-raising in pursuit of assuaging their class jealousy. They just may kill the goose that laid the golden egg.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304743704577382371561326132.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

    Take a look at California. They have driven out so much business with their ultra-left wing agenda that, surprise, the bottom has dropped out of their tax revenues and Governor Moonbeam has had to call for cuts in programs to the poor.

    Let that be a lesson: If you want to spend other people’s money, you have to let them earn it first. LOL.

  515. And when the native Americans reclaim their lands, where do you wish to go when they decide to send you “home”?

  516. My understanding is when someone is deported, they are set on tax payer money back to where they came from. We are a nation of laws, not a nation of finding exceptions to the law. They can apply for asylum, or emergency visas because of immanent dangers at home if that is indeed the case. But if they came here other than legally, then they need to leave and come back the same way everyone else did who played by the rules. You cant have it both ways. You cant say Romney broke the law when he was 18 so he should never be President (Obama did as well during his crack head days) then say these people who broke the law should get a pass.

  517. Before I check your post out let me help you with something called ASSumptions. You see I think most true Conservatives if they were honest (google honesty, I know its a term alien to Liberals) are not Mitt guys. You see we are all Anyone but Hussein Obama guys. Math doesnt lie, we cannot afford 4 more years of this kind of administration.

  518. How would nagic or his hero Mittens Robme handle this?

    A couple living a couple doors from us have volunteered for many years at a local food bank sponsored by a storefront non-denominational church. And though the church members are predominantly black, neither blacks nor hispanics make up the bulk of the population frequenting the food bank
    A youngish couple, Bekim and Nadia, who first arrived on the scene to get food bags several years ago are now regular visitors. They originally came from Albania and left because the local government appropriated their property, something that was a not un-common experience for Christians living in Albania. They were invited to this country by their cousins who had a cleaning business that was successful for the first few years but is now out of existence. Bekim and Nadia have been out of work since their cousin’s business folded and whatever they contributed to income taxes or FICA are not recoverable..
    They can’t work because they are not legal aliens and they can’t go back home to Albania because they have no home or relatives there – also they might get killed. And even if they sold off their car and their rather meager possessions, there wouldn’t be enough to pay the $2000 – $3500+ fare home.
    So their choices seem to be either Guantanamo or some kindred federal country club, forced repatriation to Albania or starvation.
    Which do you think either of the above heroes would choose?

  519. Dear Margaret & Helen:
    Thanks so much for your post. Mitt is indeed an asshat. Unfortunately, some people don’t see that as a liability. I’m glad that you both do. Voices of reason are always welcomed. I hope you lovely ladies had a fabulous Mother’s Day.
    Love,
    Iris

  520. I asked for documentation on claims about Mitt..and she needs information about me to do it? Not to mention as most hit and run posters do, she has not responded for us to even know she saw my post.

  521. You have used many names here. Provide a list so your comments can be attributed to you. This will be necessary for Fiona to complete what you have demanded of her.

  522. Anon, not sure what it is your are asking me by my comment was directed to the post
    By: fiona64 on May 14, 2012
    at 10:52 AM

  523. Nagic, provide a list of all the names you have used to facilitate Fiona’s research. With integrity like you have, I’m sure you stand by every word you have ever said.

  524. Roz, you might have better luck if you go and lie to yourself in private rather than hoping others will lie with you in public. Just sayin.

    documentation fiona, or it never happened.

  525. And PS to Barbara: What Mitt did to that young man is *assault.* Mitt also bullied a visually impaired teacher, who has said he knew he couldn’t do anything about it because Romney was the governor’s son. Moral, upstanding men do not behave as Romney did (and does).

  526. Barbara wrote of Mitt Romney: He is a moral upstanding man.

    Moral, upstanding men do not abuse animals and bully people. Moral, upstanding men do not say that GLBT people should not have equality under the law. Mitt Romney is *not* a moral, upstanding man.

  527. M & H, Thanks again for squarely hitting the nail on the head- with your usual humor and, of course, smarts. I too am getting up there in years and have remorse about some of my past callous acts. I think that the aggression I suffered and retaliated to are, hopefully, in the past.

    In that vein, is it possible to remove the few but relentless ‘asshats’ on parade in the comments of this blog? Differences of opinion are one thing, but serving up verbal aggression (bullying) in the face of differences is something much different…. It’s easy to scroll by disagreement, but when the comments are just juvenile and their aim is just to be hurtful, that crosses a line that most folks on this blog understand and respect.

    Thanks for all you do!

  528. Terri, how red faced you must be flat busted in a lie.

  529. Our Tax dollars hard at work. Way to go Hussein Obama.

    http://www.theblaze.com/stories/no-kidding-govt-issues-study-of-study-of-studies/

  530. I’m not going to play your game. You constantly refer to the President of the United States as Hussein Obama and imply he’s a Muslim. We know why. Piss off!

  531. Terri, quote me where I said there was something wrong with the name Hussein or Muslims. We both know you are a hit and run poster but lets confirm it. Because if you cannot, then I guess that makes you a liar.

  532. Hey nagic,
    What’s wrong with the name Hussein? And what’s wrong with being Muslim? You are a real bigot and we all know it.
    Please go away.

  533. It’s been a while since you had something to say but once said it’s priceless as usual.

  534. Vinaigrettegirl

    What I find interesting is that you and your typical brand of Liberal can give all of this in-depth exploration of who Mitt the man is, but you cant put 2 words together when it comes to Hussein Obama. How can we take anything you all have to say if you cannot talk about it both ways?

  535. When asked to put for this best effort, his best intellectual argument farsight responded with the following.

    ROFLMAO

    Need I say more?

  536. 2000 – The stealing of the Presidency – Greg Palast. How Florida took Democrats off the voting rolls. Looks like they are purging the voting rights of Latinos this election.

    http://crooksandliars.com/kenneth-quinnell/shades-2000-florida-going-purge-1

  537. M&H, thank you for writing again.

    As for Mr. Romney, he’s an oligarch, pure and simple, with all the hallmarks of the oligarch: bullying, entitlement, hunger for power, no sense of proportion, and no sense of personal or public history. His amnesia about assaulting a classmate is paralleled by his limited understanding of US policy towards Russia, towards Iran, towards Israel, and towards Europe. Equally, he is happy to bully women, the poor, and the middle classes.

    If he is the best the GOP have to offer then I am actually sorry for them, and for the country insofar as a healthy democracy needs a healthy dynamic of different discourses based on what is, long term, genuinely sustainable at many scales. The GOP has nothing to offer people who think about their grandkids – or their kids. Or their pets. Or their fundamental legal rights if they are female.

    Maybe at some later date, we should live so long, they’ll come up with a discourse based on other than birtherism and repression.

    Meantime, thanks again for saying it like it is!

  538. Juanita Jeans new post. Short and sweet.:

    “Republicans have been scampering to find examples of how Mitt is really a very kind, gentle, helping person. You know, when he’s not firing people from their jobs to make himself richer.”

    Read the rest here:

    http://juanitajean.com/2012/05/13/and-you-know-mitt-romney-is-kind-because-he-helps-the-lame/

  539. ROFLMAO

  540. Idiot Quote of the Day

    http://bobcesca.com/blog-archives/2012/05/idiot-quote-of-the-day.html

  541. It got you to whine and cry about it farsight…seems to me it served its purpose. I am also making note and you cry baby about the name Hussein how you have so often complained about my name. Funny thing hypocrisy. Also noting that was all you had to offer on the intellectual side. Nothing ever changes with you Libs.

  542. An interesting article:

    President Obama lays down the gauntlet on marriage equality

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/05/13/1090479/-President-Obama-lays-down-the-gauntlet-on-marriage-equality

  543. I remember when Pfesser said he would vote for Obama if Mitt was the candidate for the Rs. Pretty disingenuous of him I would say.

  544. It’s really funny how some people use Obama’s middle name to tweak liberals. So sophomoric. I actually thought Pfesser was above that but I guess I gave him too much credit. Knowing one of his favorite blogs and the commenters there maybe it was just foolish of me to expect better. Channeling his high school brat I guess.

  545. http://www.salon.com/2012/02/17/billionaire_romney_donor_uses_threats_to_silence_critics/ Romney pal Vandersloot seems charming.

  546. The bothersome part of this for me is Romney chuckling at the questions. Did you cut this guy’s hair off… “haha, no I don’t remember it” Did you say “atta girl” to a boy in class? “haha, no I don’t remember” What about the dog on the roof? “haha, he probably liked it”. What on earth is the matter with him? These things are hurtful, NOT funny. Or is it just nervous laughter because he knows he was in the wrong?

  547. Darn it. You wouldn’t know it, but my mom was an english major.

  548. Kids are idiots. They do stupid things. It goes way downhill from cutting someone’s hair off. People need to grow up on both sides of that crap. That’s a far cry from beating someone up. I got my head stuck in a trashcan by a boy. I nailed him (accidentally) with my elbow. Ha! He never did that again.And I must have sending out some sort of signals, because a girl in 7th grade walked up to my locker and asked to (ahem) me. Which was, at the time, so surprising, so completely impossible to fathom that all I could do was stare, open mouthed at her.

    Ram Dass’ (Richard Alpert, the guy who was at Harvard with Tim Leary) guru cut the hair off a western guy who came to the ashram. I don’t care about that. Really.

    As the Aussies say, “Get over yourself.” We are much older now, and I think most people who are still hung up on those years needs to move the bleep on.

    What I do care about with Mitt Romney is the scathing critique that Stockman gave. Stockman went into the same business as Mitt Romney, buying out companies and raping them. Stockman said that has nothing to do with business or running a productive enterprise. It’s tricks and crony capitalism. Romney destroyed jobs to make his millions.

    That said, Romney’s record governing Massachussetts is good. He did it well, and his health care plan was decent. All the indications I have are that he is a decent guy. He’s no saint, but the Republican party has become the party of bizarre weirdos. I don’t believe much that comes out of Romney’s mouth. And I don’t believe much that comes out of Obama’s mouth either.

    Both of them are calculating pols who say whatever they have to say to get elected. Obama has reneged on many campaign promises and even Jon Stewart skewers Obama for being in the pocket of the bankers.

    Sadly, I honestly think that Romney is, in real life, to the left of Obama. Gleah. All liars, all the time.

  549. A lot of things were acceptable until we stopped accepting.

    Peace.

  550. “Pfesser: is it possible that you apologized for some of the stuff you pulled at the age of 18? Just wonderin’ . . . .”

    Lord no! I had a ball. Boys were expected to be boys back then, not like now, when they are supposed to sit with their hands folded like seven-year-old choir girls. A very different time, indeed, before the Alan-Aldazation of the American male.

  551. Even so, in recent weeks a narrative unflattering to Barack Obama has emerged around the table: Obama doesn’t like his job. He doesn’t particularly like people and is in the wrong line of work.

    An even more damning appraisal was offered today: Obama doesn’t think he has failed America. He thinks America has failed him. Or as Joe Scarborough encapsulated the concept, Obama believes our version of democracy is a “stumbling block to his greatness
    Joe Scarborough has carried water for Obama for 4 years, guess Romney’s pranks are not quite as bad as Obama’s economy, policies and his dimming brilliance.

  552. Pfesser: is it possible that you apologized for some of the stuff you pulled at the age of 18? Just wonderin’ . . . .

  553. Mittens and the 2 BILLION DOLLAR problem of enabling Wall Street Gambling by wanting banks to be unregulated. Jamie Dimond and his friends just crapped away 2 BILLION. NO BIG DEAL???
    -Romney has claimed, loudly and frequently throughout the primary that financial regulation, and particularly Dodd-Frank, are not only unnecessary, but actively harmful. He has pledged an outright repeal of the legislation…

    http://jdvanlaningham.blogspot.com/2012/05/mitt-romney-enabling-wall-st-gambling.html

  554. WOW. Just when you thought Hussein Obama couldn’t sink any lower. He is now going after private citizens from the crime of donating to his political opponent. This my friends is the act of a desperate man who feels the winds of change biting at his heels. Liberals have no honor.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304070304577396412560038208.html?mod=wsj_share_tweet

  555. Florida election officials are examining 180,000 people on the state’s voter rolls who may not even be U.S. citizens.

    Guess Dems are right. No need to have voter I.D.’s. So far they have turned up 3000 confirmed illegally registered. And this is JUST people who are here legally from another country, but not qualified to vote.

  556. Nothing to mistrust here. Hussein Obama paying people off so help him win. Again wonder why this man is doing so much to keep his life secret.? Of course Libs don’t care, long as they win right? Right from the Rev’s mouth.

    http://www.theblaze.com/stories/book-obama-team-tried-to-pay-rev-wright-150k-to-keep-quiet-until-after-2008-election/

  557. “CEO Jamie Dimon said he did not know the extent of the problem when he said in April that the concerns were a “tempest in a teapot.””

    How much does he get paid a year? And if JPMorgan lost 2 Billion who now has that 2 BILLION…… inquiring minds ask.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/13/jamie-dimon-meet-the-press_n_1512671.html

    Peace.

  558. HAPPY MOTHER’S DAY!! Help save our youth.

  559. HAPPY MOTHER’S DAY!!

  560. Nice research delurkergurl. At least your sites are familiar, and not a quack left wing arm of the Progressives

  561. re: Obama as a socialist.

    Two observations: firstly, there are all gradations of socialist, from near-capitalist all the way to Karl Marx. I would put Hussein pretty far over the mid-point toward the red side, but, perhaps not ALL the way.

    Secondly, you can call yourself whatever you wish, but it is your behavior that determines what you really are. He may call himself Milton Friedman reincarnated, but he’s behaving like Paul Krugman. To my admittedly jaundiced eye, I’d say Hussein is definitely looking, walking and quacking like a socialist.

    And we need only look about seventy miles south of Florida, or to Albania, or to Romania, or to North Korea to see how that eventually works out.

  562. I never said Obama was a socialist. I said he hung out with Communists! Big difference in socialist and communist, just ask the Jewish community.
    Evidently he threw most of them under the bus, but they received a nice check.

    http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/the_bribe_to_silence_wright_io9jneobl3fUF0cb7LpcNM#ixzz1ul2Scvxj

    Now, that is character.

  563. Can anyone guess what the new talk radio talking point is this week? No need to look further than the hydra. :D

  564. Why It’s Dumb to Call Obama a Socialist

    http://www.businessweek.com/politics-policy/joshua-green-on-politics/archives/2012/02/why_its_dumb_to_call_obama_a_socialist.html

    Haven’t read this one yet. I have a big day of spoil & be spoiled ahead of me.

    Happy mother’s day, all you moms and people who’ve ever had a mom, too.

  565. New York Socialists: Barack Obama Is Not a Socialist

    http://blogs.villagevoice.com/runninscared/2012/01/new_york_social.php

  566. Is Obama a socialist? Socialists don’t think so. Going to split this post into 3 so Matthew doesn’t have to moderate it.

    Ask the card-carrying socialists: Is Obama one of them?

    http://articles.cnn.com/2010-04-14/politics/Obama.socialist_1_socialist-agenda-democratic-socialists-health-care-bill?_s=PM:POLITICS

    Lots of unfortunate truths in that one.

  567. Happy Mother’s Day to Margaret and Helen!!! And, Happy Mother’s Day to all the other Mothers who comment here!

  568. Communists or a Prankster?

    Do You Want a President Who Snorted Cocaine, Drank to Excess, and Hung Out with Communists or a Prankster?

  569. 99ts –

    When does the statute of limitations run out on past deeds? How far in the past should one reach, looking for mistakes? Is there any forgiveness allowed, or is everything you did, back to the cradle, fair game?

    Is crack-smoking better or worse than hair-cutting, or are they equivalent? Is real job experience important for the chief businessman of the whole country, or is “community organizer” enough for the man who can destroy the entire ball of wax with bad policy? (and, by the way, is…)

    Despite history’s hundreds of years of instruction in the merits of capitalism, vs dozens examples of socialism’s abject failure, is a socialist with no business experience whatsoever a better choice for president, or is a capitalist businessman who has had tremendous success, but cut someone’s hair when he was a rowdy boy, a better one?

    Hmmm………..tough call, that……..

    And, while I’m thinking about it, want to tell us about some of the stunts you pulled when you were a child?

    Enquiring minds want to know.

  570. It is a shame you are not a little better read 99ts. Mitt has heard up some pretty major companies. He has been answering to share holders most of his adult life. Though as a OWS person, I wouldn’t expect you to understand anything about how business works. Good news is though if a job ever opens up to make unfounded opinions about people you’ve never met, that job is yours.

  571. Bill Moyers on Polarization and what is next!!! 50 minutes.
    Happy Mother’s Day!!

    http://billmoyers.com/episode/full-show-fair-play-on-tv-and-taxes/

  572. Seems to be the first time in his life Mitt has to answer for some of his actions. He is about to learn money can’t buy everything you want and some past actions can’t be ignored nor forgotten.

    The ability to accept what was wrong and move forward is missing in his character. The ability to accept that others are allowed to be different is missing in his character. Actually he doesn’t have a character – he just has money.

  573. farsight delta opined:

    “Hypocrites. Social morons. Religion doesn’t get to be an excuse for every backwards notion and bigoted act in America.”

    Yep. Well spoken. Someday I hope the ReBiblicans see what this group of folks has done to the GOP and gets itself straightened out. Until then I fear they are going to be more and more on the margin, and a one-party system is not in anybody’s interest.

  574. How can they*

  575. How a they Susan? Obama has made sure everything that could shed the truth about him has been sealed. Which begs the question, if their is nothing to hide, why go through the en;enormous effort of covering it all up?

  576. And the nail can’t or won’t hit back…

  577. Susan, would you like to give specifics as specifics have been presented about Mitt.

  578. Did any of you cheerleaders look at what Obama did “back in the day”. More to the point, what is happening now? Who is fiddling while Rome burns? Just once, if I could see a liberal turn and look at their own folks with a clear vision. Not to be, though.

  579. Ya…or taking a snort of coke or a needle like Hussein Obama…nuff said.

  580. Somehow, I cannot imagine Abraham Lincoln or any of our country’s TRULY GREAT LEADERS taking part in high jinks like the kind Romney was involved in…… ’nuff said.

  581. riiiight…take another toke of the Obama weed plant

  582. Interesting!

    Republican Fear Factor
    Conservatives’ paranoid alternate-reality can be explained by their brain chemistry — and their media choices
    by Joshua Holland

    http://www.salon.com/2012/05/03/republican_fear_factor_salpart/singleton/

    “So conservatives appear to be more likely to be hard-wired to be highly sensitive to perceived threats, and their chosen media offers them plenty. But that’s not the whole story because of one additional factor. Since 9/11, and especially since the election of President Barack Obama, one of the most significant trends in America’s political discourse is the “mainstreaming” of what were previously considered to be fringe views on the right. Theories that were once relegated to the militia movement can now be heard on the lips of elected officials and television personalities like Glenn Beck.”

    Peace.

  583. Romney was 18 at the time of the event — that means he was an adult. And the school was a boarding school which means the boys did not go home to parents every day.

  584. Joe, when you are able to have a conversation on your own without someone elses opinion holding your hand you come talk to me.

  585. Delurkergurl did prove a point: She proved we have an idiot among us and it is not Delurkergurl. Remember: Mitttens SAVED DETROIT and Mittens also killed Osama Bin Laden too – ha, ha.

    Happy Mother’s Day tomorrow Margaret and Helen. Wishing you and all Mothers and Mothers to be a great day tomorrow!!!!

  586. Thanks for proving my point delurk. Your ridiculous notion that the kid could have come home and his parents not notice has been fully debunked by you. Priceless!!! Thanks for making my afternoon.

  587. WTG, Tamron Hall!

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/11/tamron-hall-tim-carney-mic-msnbc_n_1510311.html

    By the way, I came home with shorter hair today and my hubby said “You’re beautiful!” How I love that man! He didn’t assume I’d been tackled to the ground and humiliatingly had my hair cut off unwillingly while crying and screaming for help. Perhaps that’s more normal when a guy comes home with shorter hair?

  588. You can take a man out of the asshat but you can’t take the asshat out of the man. I mean it, really:

    http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2012/05/12/santorum-to-romney-step-up-and-use-potent-weapon-of-same-sex-marriage/?hpt=hp_t2

  589. Naa farsight, the point is that Liberals, like yourself, have to divide us before you can dismantle us. You imagine a war on women. You imagine a war on gays and lesbians. You imagine a war by the religious folks and tell everyone they are trying to take over everything. It is Liberal tradition to divide us into groups then claim one is out to get the other, and that the Liberal way will save them. Common sense be damned.

  590. Although this is off thread, I see the repression of gays and women as being part and parcel of the GOP agenda. I especially like the first comment:

    “just keep racking up points in the war on women.

    In what way is it showing respect for a woman/girl to refuse to compete against her team? That refusal only respects one’s own point of view, not the other individual.

    Hypocrites. Social morons. Religion doesn’t get to be an excuse for every backwards notion and bigoted act in America.”

    The “Hypocrites” remark really pegs the marriage equality situation as I see it!!!

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/05/11/1090817/-School-forfeits-championship-rather-than-compete-against-girl

  591. Happy Mother’s Day! I want my president to have a good memory and to be capable of self examination and personal growth.

    Some bullies seem to think spamming the blog of octogenarians is a way to support their candidate. How very brave.

  592. Top GOP Pollster to GOP: Reverse On Gay Issues

    http://andrewsullivan.thedailybeast.com/2012/05/top-gop-pollster-to-gop-reverse-on-gay-issues.html

    Anybody like to make any bets whether this will happen?!?!?

  593. Absolutely love Betty White and maybe even a little more now:

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/12/betty-white-obama-endorsement_n_1511526.html

  594. I guess when you are setting the stage for a play and the actors refuse to follow your script, all you can do is kick them off the set.

    http://gawker.com/5909717/tamron-hall-kicks-tim-carney-off-her-show-for-refusing-to-answer-romney-bullying-question

  595. Great article PFesser, To bad common sense fails to gain the attention of this group.

  596. Ladies….it’s lovely to be back in your company. I have spent the morning with your posts of recent months, after far too long away from you. Happy Mother’s Day….and keep up the fight!

  597. “Pfessor, your idea of fun is very different from mine. :sick:”

    You have no idea what my idea of fun is, but if I’d been caught for all the things I did in high school, I’d still be in jail. Ever write your name on the pavement with the spinning rear tire of a motorcycle? Grow pot in the woods? I didn’t think so. Silly now, but of course that’s the definition of youth, isn’t it? That is why they cannot make contracts, marry, etc. They have poor judgment by definition.

    I am more concerned about Mitt the Man than the Boy and whether he understands enough economics to quit trying to cover our debt by printing money. Clearly Hussein missed that lecture. Must have been studying “community organizing,” whatever that is.

    re: scissors are dangerous. Yep, like just about everything else, including a sharpened pencil or the buckle on a man’s belt. Depends on whether you use them one way or the other, doesn’t it? Did he stab the boy or cut his hair?

    ***********

    There is a great article in The Telegraph about the European socialists ire that Germany thinks people – and countries – should behave responsibly:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/9260338/Angela-Merkel-wont-let-go-of-the-euro-purse-strings.html

    This neat little excerpt puts it so well – as only those steeped in the Mother Tongue from birth can do:

    “Wiping out the debts accumulated by governments, banks and individuals is the real purpose of the “growth” agenda proposed by President-elect Hollande and the motley movement of populists of Left and Right across Europe. But capitalism cannot survive, let alone flourish, in the long run unless debts are paid, contracts are honoured and the rule of law prevails. Socialists, of course, tend to mind much less about the market economy than hard-working families who have savings and investments to lose. Indeed, France’s real national sport is épater le bourgeoisie.”

    G’day to you one and all…

  598. Poor Mitt!! This is very good!!

    http://rackjite.com/new-rules-with-bill-maher-joe-biden-and-gay-marriage-may-11-2012/

  599. Helen – I would vote for you over Mitt !!!!!

  600. Great Post Helen.

    It was assault by Mitt Romney. Mutt wants to do the same thing to the poor and middle class now. Instead o scissors he will use economic policy to put money in his pockets.

    My daughter was assaulted by a bigger boy – she whacked him with a cast she had when she broke her wrist skate boarding. He got a huge black eye and she got in school suspension. When she returned to class 3 days later, the whole class clapped and cheered because so many other people wished they had it in them to take on the bully.

    BTW: I, as parent, had no clue the bullying and intimidation had been going on until she took the boy out.

  601. Odd how men do not see how lethal a pair of scissors can be. Must be because they don’t look enough like knife.

    Since this story broke, there has been a defnite change in critical thinking on all of this. There was a spate of “high school prank” reactions and then it really changed. The assault was premeditated and based on a personal dislike in general or something strictly specific about the victim. It was carried out by a ringleader with a back-up crew. I know there a millions of people in this country who looked at this and the first thing they thought was how close it came to a lynching.

    I, too, remember the thinking regarding such behavior wayyyyyy back then. Unless the victim actually died it was tolerated. Some of the male authority figures in school actually thought it was a rite of manhood! If there was any punishment, it certainly wasn’t much and the victim was left on their own. When I was assaulted by a much bigger girl in high school, it was after school hours on the way home. The school admitted that under the circumstances they couldn’t do much about it. My mother was befuddled when I told her as this sort of thing was well beyond her understanding. However, she did get through to the principal and the assaulter was on the carpet and suspended for a period of time. She eventually came back to school but kept her distance. Yes, I was the only one she victimized during her assault season. And there was no reason for it. None whatever.

    Was she ever sorry for her behavior? As in did she ever identify with her victim? I rather doubt it.

  602. delurk, use your head for something other than a hat rack. They cut his hair. Explain to me how a kid could get his hair chopped off and the parents not know about it?

  603. It means nothing that the boy’s parents said it didn’t happen. Parents often don’t know their kids are being bullied, especially boys. A friend’s son killed himself last year because he was bullied, and his parents had no idea. They are torturing themselves over not knowing, but in his note he explained that the shame that kept him silent was just too much to bear. I wasn’t as aware of how common this silent suffering is until it happened to someone I knew. Now I hear stories like it all the time. In my opinion, it’s likely Romney’s victim’s shame was compounded further because he was gay. Times were much different then.

    This isn’t THE reason Mitt shouldn’t be President of this great nation. It’s just one more.

    Pfessor, your idea of fun is very different from mine. :sick:

  604. Right on, right on!

  605. Ah, ladies, you have done it again! I am an old Michigander. Lived there during the George Romney years. His wife, Lenore, was terrific! Long, lean and lanky lady who could light up an entire auditorium while wearing a trench coat just by beaming and saying something totally right on. I know that she told all of her kids just how dangerous scissors could be, that you should never run with them, that they could injure and even be lethal. I would bet money that when she found out about this bullying her hair caught on fire! Its odd how Ann Romney went about recently declaring how Mitt had a real sense of humor all his own. I think they both knew that something like this — lets call it by its real name, assault — was eventually going to surface. Well, the ploy didn’t work. I was viciously assaulted in high school by a much bigger girl who damn near killed me and I have never forgotten it. This experience has pretty much lent shape to my life for well over six decades. I know there are others out there who had similar experiences in high school and how it impacted the rest of their lifetime. Mitt, you may have “forgotten” (they will be playing hockey in Hell over your amnesia), but the victims never do. And because you “can’t remember” Iwhen so many others do and you make light of it all, I am positive that this is part of your character and should never be allowed to run loose in the White House. Can’t wait to vote in November!

  606. The funniest part of the Mitten saga is he doesn’t remember the incident at all, but he does remember he didn’t assault the boy because he was gay! You can’t make this stuff up!

  607. Mitt is either lying about not remembering, or he really doesn’t remember. Which is scarier?

  608. New defination of trolls: Someone who disagrees with the sheeple, and happens to be more informed. I’m ok with that. This site may be the only place these people see the truth, I do not watch Fox news. I read the Wall Street Journal, Judicial Watch, Congress.org, The Hill, my locat newspaper.
    I don’t watch national news on TV because there is no real journalism there.
    I also watch a great deal of C Span. You might try to enlighten yourselves rather than agree on silly simple agruments about something that happend 40 years ago. By the way, the family of this bullied boy say it never happened!
    I saw that on Huffington Post.

  609. From his two books, perhaps you should have read them before the 08 elections. He also said “should the winds change, I will stand with the Muslims”. Wonder what he meant by that?

  610. In response to the statement that the KKK were democrats, look at the history of southern politicians. The south was democratic until the democrats wanted to desegregate, then they all turned to the Republican Party. Strom Thurmond started as a democrat, as did Jesse Helms, both extremely bigoted men.

  611. re: “trolls”

    I would define a troll the usual way: someone who posts for no reason at all except to elicit a personal reaction, while completely ignoring the topic. One example of that might be, well, someone who calls people who disagree with his/her POV, “trolls,” while refusing to address any of their points.

    My experience is that, when the name-calling starts it’s a sure sign the writer is out of ideas.

  612. It occurs to me that those who condemn the acts of a high-school child (yes, they definitely ARE children) often do so out of a sanctimony borne of personal dullness. My experience is that THEY never got in any trouble – not because THEY were angels – rather because they were the dullest kids in the school and are still jealous of those who were not.

    I’m sure if Romney knew he were going to be a Presidential candidate, subject to a thorough probing of every orifice during every minute of his life, he would have been more careful when he was fifteen – or whenever it was. Me? I could never run for President – or dogcatcher. I had too much damned fun.

    My personal suggestion is that we all stop living in the far-distant past, even though it provides some great “gotcha” moments – and concentrate on what we are going to do NOW about straightening out this great Country, which is, to my eye, headed toward the greatest financial disaster of all time. Clearly, Bush-the-Lesser put us here, but Hussein hasn’t done a damned thing to get us out except print money in hopes of kicking the can beyond the next election.

    Disgusting men, both.

  613. From Wikipedia:

    While some bullies are arrogant and narcissistic,[41] others can use bullying as a tool to conceal shame or anxiety or to boost self esteem: by demeaning others, the abuser him/herself feels empowered.

    I would say the Mitt fits into the arrogant and narcissistic group. He may have been concealing shame, anxiety or boosting self esteem. I would be willing to bet a month’s salary that demeaning other gives him a sense of empowerment. No doubt he carried this into adulthood and his vulture capitalism. Wow, make money by victimizing decent people. Must have been an absolute dream come true.

  614. Helen, please forgive the troll rant. I wanted to get this out of the way right off the bat. I think you and Margaret rock. I consider this troll’s behavior to be severely disrespectful to your site and not in keeping with the discourse pursued by 99% of your posters. I realize you and Matthew have ultimate power to ban and probably have your reasons for accepting his presence (maybe you want to have your one token vile spewing asshat court jester).

    Now look what I have done. Gone and put the focus on the troll which is exactly what he desires.

    We love and look forward to your posts! Any time you are inclined to submit a new one, we will be here to devour it on the spot. I mean it indubitably!

  615. farsight, you have taken over Donna’s job of telling the sheeple what to do? Good for you kiddo, way to step up.

    Because you wouldn’t be saying all that if you thought they were smart enough to figure it out on their own right?

  616. Remember:

    “Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference.” Mark Twain

    “Don’t argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience”.Greg King

    And this is one very experienced idiot.

    Glad to be a liberal that tells it like it is; doesn’t mince words nor beat around the bush.

    Quotes sometimes state your thoughts so much more eloquently than your own words. They are also well known quotes for multiple reasons!

  617. Ok folks. Nagic is a troll who has been haunting this sight under that name and some others for some time. Look at his first post above and notice that it is posted solely to elicit negative emotion and a reaction on your part. He tries to disrupt and make the thread all about him. If you respond or continue to discuss him, he has attained his goal. It is very much like the terrorists winning by taking away our privacy and rights with the TSA at airports and the passing of the patriot act. He is and energy taker and tries to suck the life out of you. He has even bragged about this on the recent “Rush” post as Anonymous.

    Pfesser, please don’t defend the troll’s behavior after reading that first comment of his on this post. Contrary to your stated position, I already know you suffer fools gladly just don’t encourage one (I went to one of your other hangouts and know that what you consider adult and civil discourse is mostly crass and sophomoric BS. Granted, many posters are very well written but several of the posters exceed your stated tolerance.)

  618. Lets keep it real ladies. For those supporting Hussein Obama
    Guantanamo is still open !!!
    NDAA expanded indefinite detention to YOU !!!
    We have MORE military conflicts, not less !!!
    Your government is LESS accountable !!!
    Your corn muffins still contain GMO’s !!!
    New GMO’s have been approved !!!
    GMO’s are STILL not labeled !!!
    Wall Street has MORE privacy !!!
    Big Pharmaceuticals has MORE reign !!!
    By CPI, your dollar is worth about $0.73 !!!
    Gas prices are about 200% of what they were !!!
    5-%+ of your Democratic friends have RE-REGISTERED as “No Party Affiliation” !!!

    You see, I’ve read history. I understand the KKK and Jim Crow were supported by Democrats !!!

    I am fully aware that Planned Parenthood was founded by the RACIST Margaret Sanger and that the black abortion rate is OBSCENELY HIGH !!!

    Only the Democrats would have a former Ku Klux Klan member as a Senator, and a former Black Panther co-founder as a Congressman !!! And they call US racist !?!

    I watched as the same Democrats that attacked Clarence Thomas DEFENDED Bill Clinton’s sexual harassment !!!

    Hussein Obama has campaigned more than the last 5 Presidents COMBINED !!!

    In the 3 years Hussein Obama has been in office, he and his wife have spent more than $80 million on vacations !!!

    Opra is worth a staggering $2.7 Billion, yet Liberals are made at Mitt for being worth $250 mil !!!

    Apparently I am supposed to be more angry about what Mitt does with his money than Hussein Obama does with mine !!!

    People have to prove they have insurance but they DONT have to prove they are CITIZENS !!!

    Reaganomics, start a billion dollar business in your parent’s garage. Obamanomics,, spend the rest of your life LIVING in your parent’s garage !!!

    I am not voting against Hussein Obama because his skin is dark. I am voting against him because his soul is !!!

    And remember, You teach a man to fish, you lose a Democrat voter !!!

    P.S. As for who we can trust.
    Hussein Obama
    1. Occidental College records: SEALED !!!
    2. Columbia College records” SEALED !!!
    3. Columbia Thesis paper: SEALED !!!
    4. Harvard College records: SEALED !!!
    5. Selective Service Registration: SEALED !!!
    6. Medical Records: SEALED !!!
    7. Illinois Senate schedule: SEALED !!!
    8. Illinois State Senate records: SEALED !!!
    9. Law practice client list: SEALED !!!
    10. Certified copy of Original Birth Certificate: SEALED !!!
    11. Signed Embossed paper Certification of Live Birth: SEALED !!!
    12. Baptism record: SEALED !!!
    13. Michelle Obama can no longer practice law? WHY?!?!?!
    14. Michelle has 22 aids while other first ladies only had 1 !!!
    15. Foreign student aid as a college student ?!?!?!?!
    .

  619. Obviously the paid rightwingers are pouncing… Mitt can’t remember the incident, but can remember that he didn’t think the guy was a homosexual. Two lies obviously.

  620. Anon
    What part of “(per his book)” didnt you understand?

  621. Jo..splain this please.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/30/us-corporate-tax-rate_n_1392310.html

    I am betting you wont.

  622. Where do you get your information Bacgammon?……Fox News?? Unfair and biased.

  623. Clearly, the crazies are trying to co-opt the goodness and common sense and decency that this blog and comment board exemplify. I was saddened and shocked by what I just read. Let’s begin with lie #1–it happens that taxes are now at their lowest rate in 40 years. i just hope that, exposed to enough decency, love, and common sense, eventhese souls can.be redeemed.

  624. Thank you so much ladies. This truly does open the door to Obama’s activities as a youth. How about the fact that his name was Barry Soreoto while attending Muslim school, and then later Barry Obama. He now goes by Barack Hussain Obama. How about the fact that he did cocaine and marijuana (per his book). He also had a life void of parental supervision and school records that have been sealed for the duration of his life. If those records were not sealed, imagine what we could know about his true character!
    Happy mothers day and keep drinking the libber cool aid.

  625. The result of an Obama-nation. Highest tax in the world and this is what you get for your troubles.

    http://techcrunch.com/2012/05/11/eduardo-saverin-facebook-ipo-us-citizenshi/?ncid=webmail15

    Sure looks like we are on the right path to recovery. Tax until people renounce their citizenship.

  626. At least Mitt isnt a former crack addict like Obama.

  627. Like so many others, I was pleased to find your post this morning. You have done so much to help mr articulate what I believe. I love your common sense and your common decency. I also loved the commenter who admitted a cruel act of bullying, but also felt pain whenever remembering that act and his behavior. Thank you!

  628. Welcome back Helen & Margaret. Have a fine Mother’s Day.
    It’s nice to see all the sane people back again but I know it will all be over as soon as all the crackpots come back and drive everyone else away.

  629. Thank you for the new post! You all are great!

  630. Yes, yes, and yes!

  631. Yay! Helen AND Margaret!

    Good to see a new post.

    Happy Mothers Day! :grin:

    There are so many other reasons not to vote for Mitt, the high school behavior was a long time ago. Teenagers can be very hateful and cruel. Peer pressure is extreme. Some actually do grow out of it, while others never do.

  632. Thank you, Ladies.Helen: did Rick Perry drive you out of Texas. You say you’re in Georgia – Newtyville. So true, everything you said. Glad to see you back. Happy Mother’s Day.

  633. Keep the commentary coming! There is so much to be concerned about regarding Mitt Romney’s character, including his love of firing people, outsourcing jobs, lying about fixing the auto industry, and so forth. When a man is so out of touch with common people(“I’m a car guy. I have two, and Ann has a couple of Cadilacs.”) that he thinks nothing of building an elevator for his cars at his California house, I know he doesn’t understand the plight of the middle class and those below. Love you both!

  634. wrongo — I think you’d make a FABulous president! :)
    Carolyn

  635. Love you, Helen and Margaret!

  636. God bless you both!

  637. So glad to see your new post! it’s been way too long, especially with all the nuts on the repub side, Then you come on with a new post that puts todoys worlld in a nutshell. Thanks! Happy Mothers Day Ladies and to all of you oout there Happy Mothers DAy!

  638. Oh Margaret and Helen!
    Once again I am compelled to laugh and cry over your post! You are so correct! And…when I was listening to npr this morning..they noted that this release of Mitt Romney’s bullying came right after Obama’s acknowledgement of being okay on gay marriage. It is rather interesting isn’t it? It makes me proud of how we play the game!! I hope for more Romney collapse, lol! I can’t wait for the debates between Romney and Obama! He’ll just suck air! LOL!!!

  639. Margaret & Helen, you gals are great. Mary

  640. To Barbara….you obviously were a bully if you can make light of this so called ‘prank” …this was more like an attack!!! How could a person ever forget doing something like this….But then again I find very few conservatives to be kind and invoking the name of Jesus was a real nice touch….Hypocrite!!!

  641. Evalyn, I think that you nailed it.

  642. Leave to you gals to hit the ole nail on the head… or pin Mittens actions to the bulletin board for public exposure.

    A classy man would have said… “I did some stupid things as a teenager, I regret them deeply. I was wrong.” But no, he pulled out the etch a sketch and kept shaking it, changing his story repeatedly, qualifying, excusing, not owning up.

    We didn’t have ink pots when I was in school, but instead I took a lipstick and wrote something kinda nasty on a teacher’s car after he disciplined me for something I didn’t think fair. I was caught. I had to face him. I apologized unequivocally and sincerely. I remember shedding some tears of regret for doing something so stupid. The teacher I “hated” so much, said he’d forgave me and not report me to the main office if I promised to never do anything like that again and if I’d please clean off the mess. I kept my word, he kept his, and I figured the least I could do was work hard to earn an A in his class.

  643. Barbara, short-sheeting a bed is a prank. Holding someone down while they cry and scream for help is assault. Laughing about it after the fact, which is what Romney did in an interview about it yesterday, is the antithesis of being moral.

  644. Happy mother’s day indeed! Ya’ll are some classy broads

  645. Taping a “kick me” sign to someone’s back is a prank. A bunch of guys holding another guy down and cutting his hair off is assault. Amazing some people don’t understand the difference.

  646. I don’t see much difference between what Mitt did as a teen and what GWBush did as president. Bullying is a sign of weakness, manifest in pushing around people who can’t defend themselves (Axis of
    Evil, anyone?), backing yourself up with a band of thugs (Karl Rove, Dick Cheney), and expecting people to accept such behavior as normal, as in “if you aren’t with me, you’re are against me”. I believe the clinical term is sociopath.

  647. I think you shouldn’t vote. You obviously are very judgmental. Times were different then. Pranks were the norm. To be this highly sensitive to a prank is crazy. Did the pranks back then go too far from time to time? Yes and that’s why they stopped allowing them. But you have to look at the entire man. The problem with Mitt is that nobody can find the normal things wrong to pick at with him. He is a moral upstanding man. Is he perfect? No. But if you want to find a perfect candidate, you will have to wait until Jesus Christ comes back. He is the only perfect man.

  648. Great post Helen! Love that you’re back!!! Besides, the comments on the last post were getting a bit long in the tooth and brought back the infamous Tex, a gem that one!

  649. I am 75 and still remember the stupid and thoughtless things done as a teen. Don’t for a moment believe Mitt doesn’t remember that horrible incident. He is a liar and a bigot.

  650. BS, He remembers the incident. He doesn’t fool us for one minute. To bad the individual is deceased. I bet he wouldn’t have forgotten!! Give me a break.

  651. Sorry Margaret and Helen, I forgot to thank you for the post. You can tell this subject is a sore point with me the way I just jumped in.

    Thanks a lot for telling it like it is. Appreciate it, and Happy Mother’s Day!

  652. My son was bullied in schoold starting in the fourth grade when another child saw him cross his legs and labeled him as gay for doing so. The next thing you knew, the entire school was calling him gay. He said he was not and is not gay. He was with these children up until they all left high school. This was not about his sexual orientation, this was about bullying. They were merciless. Prior to getting in the sixth grade, he cried all summer, did not want to go back to school. My son is scarred to this day. He mistrusts people, has learned to keep to himself and to only trust himself. The hatred he had for school was due to the bullying, he was not a dumb kid. He grew to 6’3” and has bulked up. Nobody dared bully him in college. He was not dumb but did rather poorly in many subjects thanks to feeling like an outcast. My son is about to graduate from college Magna Cum Laude. Still, I know he has not forgotten.

    People need to do a better job with their children, regardless of their situation in life. Mitt should have known better. A child of priviledge, surrounded by people with a wolf pack mentality, feeling entitled to do anything they felt like doing, to anybody, any time, without regard to consequences to that person. Has he changed much really? No, Mitt, what you did was wrong. You were old enough to have known better because you would not have liked it if anybody has treated you in the same manner. I am tired of bullies and I don’t want one as my president.

  653. Another question to consider: if bullying and not “remembering” is a Romney character trait, what does that say about what he would do to other countries and governments? Would he push them around, withhold support and claim victory? How will other governments & peoples view as with a bully for a president? Would there be clandestine actions that Romney won’t remember to cover his own ass? There have been plenty of bullies in office before, but the time has come for compassion and respect. We need to give time to the process of change, and give Obama a little more support and encouragement. It’s time to let bygones be bygones, get on with our own lives and let others live theirs, no matter what we think of their lifestyle. We need legislators and presidents that will acknowledge and respect all individuals for their abilities and contributions to this country, their communities, schools and families. We respect all religions as a lifestyle, so I think it’s time we honor GLBTQ alongside racial and gender equality. This is a new century, and a new time. The perfect time for change.

  654. New reader and love you!

    The thing that bothers me most about the Mittens as Bully story is not that it may or may not be accurate, but rather that it seems plausible. I read the details and think “Sure, I can see him doing that.”. Not really the kind of feeling you want about your president.

  655. Bravo! I couldn’t agree more. We all did crazy stuff when we were young? Maybe, Mittens, but 99% of us didn’t accost another human being.

    I vehemently disagree with those saying this is “in the past” and it shouldn’t be part of the discourse for presidential election. This speaks (LOUDLY) to the character of the individual. Not only the past act, but also the current lack of remorse or even ACKNOWLEDGING. Presidential material? Nope.

    The leader I want to elect is the one who stood up for those being bullied. The one who had the chutzpah to take a stand that wasn’t popular. Or maybe even the one who was bullied or discriminated against. That tends to breed empathy, compassion and wisdom that a privileged bully can never know.

    Thank you for writing this.
    Love this blog.

  656. Mitt Romney is a liar. There are lots of instances, and his supposed memory lapse regarding this incident is just one of them. If he had said he remembered, and then apologized, it woud have gone away. But he can’t man up and admit to it, so he makes it worse by lying about it. He is not presidential material.

  657. Common decency. Unfortunately it usually not common any more nor decent! Thanks for stating it so well!

    Happy Mothers Day!

  658. Thank you for your post. Maybe the bullies don’t remember, but you can bet the bullied do. It says alot about the bullies’ character — or lack thereof.

  659. I for one, ( being in the same age group as Romeny) never bullied a fellow classmate or any other human being. You just don’t have too – unless you are self centered, have low self esteem and want to make your self look bigger in the eyes of your self centered bully friends. I’m just sayin…..

  660. So, Mittens doesn’t remember the incident. Hmm . . . Well, now we know he’s a bully AND a liar. A teenage bully, I can forgive – we were all young and idiotic at some point. But now he’s all grown up and lying. Do I detect a broken moral compass?

  661. Leave it to the both of you to get it exactly right! How could Mitt not remember such an event? He is such a liar! My sister did the same thing to me when I was 18, and trust me, it was terrifying. I didn’t know if I would have ears left when she was done venting her wrath. I don’t know what is worse- a president with no memory or a president with no morals or conscience, but am tending toward the latter. We have already had the no memories one.
    I also remember being dragged into the boys restroom and tied to the toilet by my classmates and some older boys when I was 5. They then began chanting “Nazi, Nazi” and hitting me. I didn’t know what Nazi meant, but figured out pretty fast that it was something really bad. Why did they do this? Probably because I still spoke German better than English and it was 1956, so memories of the war were still very much alive. They didn’t get in trouble either, but one of the teachers did eventually untie me. BTW, this happened in a Lutheran school.

    Thank you, ladies, for your wise words. I was just wondering the other day when you would be writing again.

  662. Outstanding stuff. Thanks ladies!
    Mike
    thedriveto195.blogspot.com

  663. Whoops! 11:39 was me.

  664. Helen, Helen, I have to wonder about you, the little boy in the Third Grade who dipped my pigtail into the inkwell had a crush on me and wanted to get my attention. He really got my mother’s attention and not in a good way. :^)

  665. Just a truly honest appraisal of Mitts rotten behavior, ladies, and I’m so happy you posted the truth about it. It’s just too difficult [it makes me want to constantly vomit to listen to his blatant lies] to follow all the garbage Mittens produces, but I did hear about his lame and utterly unapology to that poor gay student he bullied. Why is it the wealthy can always get away with horrible behavior? None of the GOP candidates were worthy of being Bo Obama’s dog sitter let alone POTUS.

    Happy Mother’s Day to you both!

  666. You are so correct! “Mittens” is all thumb and no fingers! You get right to the point!

  667. Great post! A happy Mother’s Day to both of you.

  668. I just read this post out loud to my parents who are in their 70’s. They are now your newest fans.

  669. I agree with dmalmq…would you really want a President who has such a faulty memory? I’m sure this resonates with you ladies…not that you have the problem yourselves, of course, but that you’re well read on the subject given you subscribe to AARP magazine.

  670. If one of their sons had done the same thing Mitt did, I doubt his parents would have given a crap because I doubt they would consider anything wrong with it. The better question to ask might be, how would they have reacted if one of THEIR sons was assaulted in this manner? Although I suspect they wouldn’t have an answer, because they’re simply couldn’t fathom someone doing this to one of their own. People with no empathy whatsoever usually have that problem.

  671. Reblogged this on While you were sleeping and commented:
    I love Margaret and Helen, and hope you do too…

  672. Damn, I’ve missed you Margaret…. And yes, Helen, I believe he is just an asshat.

  673. Thank you! I wanted to quote so much of this that I figured it was better to just post the link ;-)

  674. I was so happy to find Margaret and Helen in my inbox this morning!! I’ve been wondering what you were thinking about all the hoohah going on lately. While I don’t judge people by what they did as youth, I do consider what they have done since. Clearly Romney hasn’t changed his behaviours .. and in that case, and also considering his lame apology, it does bear scrutiny.

    Happy Mothers day!

  675. M&H,
    Thanks as always. You always seem to capture the nub of the thing. And I agree. He’s really just an asshat.

  676. yay!!!!

    They are back! Thank the Lord!

    Keep em coming girls… <3

  677. Helen,
    I would like to thank you for expressing your opinion so eloquently. I feel the same way but could never put my opinion into words the way you have.
    Please continue to post. You and Margret make my day when you post!

  678. I vote for M&H, or at the very least put them on the Cabinet. You nailed it, I wish you the happiest of Mother’s Days and pls keep making our days by staying in touch and sharing your humor and insight.

  679. So glad to have you back … and a new subscriber and so totally hear you!! Looking forward to the political input this important election year! OBAMA/BIDEN 2012

  680. Stacy Belford wrote: I can’t see condemning a person for something he did in high school. We all did mean, stupid things back then, I still cringe about some of my behaviors.

    Not everyone did. I was bullied so much that I stopped even trying to make friends … even with those who reached out to me. Do you know what I did as an adult? I apologized to those people who reached out to me, because I remembered that they had tried to be kind and I understood that I didn’t have the tools to accept it then. I’m glad to say that, 30 years after high school, some of those people are among my dearest and closest friends.

    Bullies don’t remember their evil acts because they don’t care. Hell, a *teacher* witnessed the high school quarterback *hitting me* and told me to go back to class and forget that it happened. That’s the kind of thing that makes it easier for people to say just what you did above, Stacy. Condoning this crap, and pretending that it doesn’t say something about a person’s character, on the grounds that “everyone does it” when that’s patently untrue? Ugh. Words fail me.

  681. That’s what I keep saying…in all of America this is the best they can do?
    PfftIt

    It’s hard to beat President Obama, but you’d think they would try a little harder! That clown car was a disgrace! I would be ashamed to say I was a Repubilcan!

  682. Helen – We need you two to get out of the kitchen more often…..please! We need your common sense in this world of crazy. Happy Mother’s Day to you both and to all the mothers here.

    Peace.

  683. I can’t see condemning a person for something he did in high school. We all did mean, stupid things back then, I still cringe about some of my behaviors. I was also on the receiving end of being bullied. There was one incident that still bothers me, yet I’m sure the kids who did it don’t have the slightest memory of it. Mitt needs to give a sincere apology, not the offhanded one he put out there yesterday, and then everyone needs to focus on the crap he’s pulled since high school and work on not getting him elected.

  684. I missed you Helen! So glad you are back. Mitt is a tool!

  685. Oh, I have missed you so much! Thank you for another great post. I’m sure there will be complainers, but what’s new? Love you!!!

  686. Thank you for this woinderful post.

  687. That was me, your loyal fan Mikat

  688. Helen and Margaret,
    So happy to see you post again. We have missed you. While you are away the whack a doodles get pretty loud and crazy. Hope all is well with you and yours. Looking forward to your cookbook and your next post. Love you ladies!

  689. Go Helen!
    Go Obama!!
    FORWARD!!!!!!!!

  690. Thank you, ladies! Right as ever.

    Mitt’s attempt to wash his mitten,
    doesn’t make him a good kitten.
    I smell a rat close by!

  691. Helen, I love your posts and your common sense. I agree, there is no way Mittens doesn’t remember this.

  692. I know it’s going to be a good day when I open my email and find a message from Margaret and Helen. Thank you!

  693. Helen, thank you for calling little Mitty out, for the world to see (I had not heard this) and in such a perfect way. One in 300 million, indeed. and Margaret, thanks for using Asshat. I love you both.

  694. She’s baaacck!
    Let the campaign season begin!!!

  695. Right as always ladies. What gets me is Mittens says he doesn’t remember the incident but still apologized for it. Obviously he knows he was at least capable of doing such things or he wouldn’t have.

  696. Thank you Helen.

  697. I can’t get past the dog strapped to the top of the car. Why can’t Romney just admit he was wrong and cruel for doing that? Instead, he still tries to defend it and make light of it.

  698. You are who I want to be when I grow up.

  699. I still remember high school events after nearly 50 years. Maybe Mitt has a touch of memory loss. Just what we don’t need, a bully who can’t remember bullying in the White House.

  700. Glad to have you back!!! You were truly missed…& as usual you hit the bulls eye…Bullying is bullying and it seems to me Romney just utilizes a more “adult ” form of bullying when he takes people’s livelihood away from them in the name of profits for the rich!!! Happy Mother;s Day Ladies!!!

  701. You guys rock! Right on! Mitt is a rich-boy bully, mean to animals and the vulnerable. And a plutocrat. Really, I’d rather have one of you as president – anyday – than this ‘asshat’ (love that!)

  702. No way Mitt doesn’t remember – unless he did this type of thing so often, he can’t remember this particular time. Sad.

  703. Must say I love reading your posts. I so agree with everything you said. Wishing you both a very Happy Mother’s Day. Please keep posting, you make my day!

  704. The damage to the kid whose hair was chopped of has not even been discussed. In high school, three older girls held me down to see if my pubic hair matched my red hair. It was traumatic. I did not tell anyone, not my parents, not my teachers and not my friends. I certainly remember who they were and, after more than 50 years, don’t think of it often but I DO REMEMBER.

  705. I’ve been waiting and waiting for a post. I just keep thinking what will Margaret say. Thank you, thank you both.

  706. We’ve missed you, Helen & Margaret! Have a very happy mother’s day. I hope your kids and grandkids do something very thoughtful for each of you. I hope you get bacon and no jello!

  707. Bless both of you! And while Obama is by no means perfect, I’d take him any day over Romney

  708. I don’t care what Mitt did in high school so much as the fact he doesn’t remember that he did that. I bullied a kid when I was thirteen. I did something that totally humiliated him, and I was kicked out of Boy Scouts for it. I remember it as if it were yesterday, and feel awful any time I think back to that.

  709. I couldn’t agree more. Surely we can find someone who had the decency to respect others rather than bully them. Some things just ought to be non-starters for an office of this magnitude.

  710. Oh, and by the way, he just can’t remember doing anything like that.

  711. As usual, Helen hits the nail.


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